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Bobref

Should ND Decline the Bowl Invitation?

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4 minutes ago, Irishman said:

Clemson beat Alabama by a wider spread than they did ND; so did Alabama not belong either? While ND was the weaker of the 4 teams last year, no one else had done what they needed to replace them in that 4 slot. Now, the previous season, no doubt, BUT Bama was in a class by itself. They would have beaten the doors off of ANY team they would have played that year; even if it had been a rematch with Georgia. 

I would also disagree with the comment that most SEC schools are willing to do things others are not. In recent seasons, there have been 2 MAYBE 3 good teams. This year, I would say 4, giving Georgia some credit; then again, LSU certainly dispelled any thoughts about UGA. 

I do agree that the gap between the top few programs and the rest is as big as it has ever been. And, as others have said, for a program at a school like Notre Dame to be where they are, with the tougher admission standards. I am not making excuses for them. I would LOVE to see them take the next step as far as being competitive. Playing teams like Georgia, Clemson, Alabama down the road a bit is a good way to measure where the program is. 

Next year: Clemson @ Notre Dame, Nov. 7.  We could use some nice, cold South Bend weather that Saturday.

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23 hours ago, Bobref said:

Some would advocate just accepting this as the “new normal.” 

So they will just accept irrelevance?  Hardly the "caliber" of the grand old dame.

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1 hour ago, itiswhatitis said:

So they will just accept irrelevance?  Hardly the "caliber" of the grand old dame.

I said “some.” 

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2 hours ago, itiswhatitis said:

So they will just accept irrelevance?  Hardly the "caliber" of the grand old dame.

I don’t think Notre Dame will ever be “irrelevant.”   But getting rid of Kelly would be a bad move.

It’s playoff or bust of these days which puts them in even more of a precarious position as they don’t even get a chance to compete for a conference championship as a consolation prize.

 They were eliminated from playoff contention the moment they lost to Georgia in early September and dirt was thrown on top of their grave after they lost to Michigan. They played a lot of “irrelevant” games after that.

Edited by Temptation

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On 12/13/2019 at 3:34 PM, Sacked said:

Just curious. What do you think that these schools do that other are not willing to do? 

Any more questions after what transpired last night after the game?

 

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42 minutes ago, Temptation said:

Any more questions after what transpired last night after the game?

 

What? Some of us can’t stay up that late.

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Thoughts on a 4-loss Wisconsin team and Minnesota finishing higher than Notre Dame in the final rankings? The Irish obliterated a team that Oklahoma, Baylor, and Iowa struggled with. 

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14 minutes ago, BTF said:

Thoughts on a 4-loss Wisconsin team and Minnesota finishing higher than Notre Dame in the final rankings? The Irish obliterated a team that Oklahoma, Baylor, and Iowa struggled with. 

The butt-whipping they took from Michigan - a team exposed as a pretender - sealed their fate. They’ve won 33 games over the last 3 seasons. But they deserved what they got.

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On 12/10/2019 at 8:55 AM, Bobref said:

college football rankings

Georgia, Michigan, USC, Navy, and Virginia. So much for the whole “Notre Dame doesn’t play anyone” argument. How many other schools played 5 top 25 teams? I am not going to look that up, but my initial guess is zero.

 

Not on the same level as Notre Dame this season in win-loss, but Texas A&M played five of the Top 15 this season.  Also, at the time that they played, three of these were ranked #1 ... Alabama, Clemson, and LSU ... and Georgia was ranked #4 with Auburn at #8 at the time.  Lost by 14 to Clemson, 8 to Auburn, and 6 to Georgia.

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11 hours ago, Bobref said:

The butt-whipping they took from Michigan - a team exposed as a pretender - sealed their fate. They’ve won 33 games over the last 3 seasons. But they deserved what they got.

So when Snider comes with-in a field goal of a Carmel team that is considered one of their all time "greats", it' because rain is the "great equalizer." I heard that several times from several people on this forum. The same doesn't apply at the college level? Sad that Notre Dame's season has to be judged on a game played on the road in a monsoon. Kirk Herbstriet made a pitch in 2018 that Ohio State should have been the fourth playoff team instead of ND despite getting crushed by Purdue in a game in which they were completely embarrassed. It just seems like there is a different set of rules when it comes to ND.

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52 minutes ago, BTF said:

So when Snider comes with-in a field goal of a Carmel team that is considered one of their all time "greats", it' because rain is the "great equalizer." I heard that several times from several people on this forum. The same doesn't apply at the college level? Sad that Notre Dame's season has to be judged on a game played on the road in a monsoon. Kirk Herbstriet made a pitch in 2018 that Ohio State should have been the fourth playoff team instead of ND despite getting crushed by Purdue in a game in which they were completely embarrassed. It just seems like there is a different set of rules when it comes to ND.

Rain does not make a 31 point difference my man...especially when both teams had to deal with it.

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17 hours ago, Temptation said:

Any more questions after what transpired last night after the game?

 

Yeah, that made me despise LSU that much more. 

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Post season rankings don't mean anything. The only thing that matters is being the last team standing after the playoffs. Guys  who look at post season rankings, use them as a measuring contest to talk trash to their buddies. Heck, I would argue pre-season rankings matter more, because they somewhat set the pecking order for next year.

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5 hours ago, MarshallCounty said:

 

I disagree. Post season rankings matter from recruiting to the pre-season pecking order. That ranking is how you finished the season. What position that you was that year. Would it be better if there was an actual tournament like basketball has to decide that? Absolutely! But as long as you only have a 4 team playoff, the ranking are all you have. 

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5 hours ago, MarshallCounty said:

Post season rankings don't mean anything. The only thing that matters is being the last team standing after the playoffs. Guys  who look at post season rankings, use them as a measuring contest to talk trash to their buddies. Heck, I would argue pre-season rankings matter more, because they somewhat set the pecking order for next year.

Cleaned that up:   tisk tisk   Be better than that 

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4 hours ago, Sacked said:

I disagree. Post season rankings matter from recruiting to the pre-season pecking order. That ranking is how you finished the season. What position that you was that year. Would it be better if there was an actual tournament like basketball has to decide that? Absolutely! But as long as you only have a 4 team playoff, the ranking are all you have. 

But head to head is pointless.  Why even play the games?

I saw WITH MY OWN EYES, Notre Dame get drilled by Michigan...the postseason rankings disagree.

I also saw Minnesota beat Penn State...

Saw Wisconsin beat Minnesota...

Michigan beat Iowa...

Auburn beat Oregon AND Alabama...

Texas beat Utah...

 

After the top 4 the rankings mean NOTHING.  They are laughable.

 

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1 hour ago, Temptation said:

But head to head is pointless.  Why even play the games?

I saw WITH MY OWN EYES, Notre Dame get drilled by Michigan...the postseason rankings disagree.

I also saw Minnesota beat Penn State...

Saw Wisconsin beat Minnesota...

Michigan beat Iowa...

Auburn beat Oregon AND Alabama...

Texas beat Utah...

 

After the top 4 the rankings mean NOTHING.  They are laughable.

 

Then why should the top 4 matter? Do you honestly believe that was the 4 best teams in 2019? 

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43 minutes ago, Sacked said:

Then why should the top 4 matter? Do you honestly believe that was the 4 best teams in 2019? 

The top 4 ENTERING bowl season, my mistake.

They are the only ones of EIGHTY teams that actually play in a meaningful bowl game.

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3 hours ago, Temptation said:

 

After the top 4 the rankings mean NOTHING.  They are laughable.

 

It's really just a measurement of how you did that season. I agree that it's good for recruiting. Some schools use it to tout how many top ten finishes they've recorded in the past "x" amount of years. I'm sure it means a ton to those directly involved in the program. For a school like Navy, finishing in the Top 25 is kind of a big deal. 

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4 hours ago, Temptation said:

 

I saw WITH MY OWN EYES, Notre Dame get drilled by Michigan...the postseason rankings disagree.

 

Overall body of work. Michigan was the better team the night they played ND. Michigan might even win 8 of 10 against the Irish because of how they match up against them. But because ND got waxed by Michigan doesn't mean they would have lost to Wisconsin by 21. It doesn't mean they would lose to Penn State by 7. It doesn't mean they would have struggled against Army. 

Which team should have been ranked higher? That's debatable.Like I've said all season, 4-15 is a crapshoot. Michigan looked great in waxing ND and IU. They were impressive in beating Iowa. In big games though, they were 1-3 with all three losses being blowouts. Notre Dame at least put up a fight when they played at Georgia. Waxing Navy and Iowa State played in ND's favor among the voters. 

How will the Wolverines be next year? The media seems to love them at the beginning of the year...........every year. Early rankings for 2020 even have them ahead of the Irish. Although oddsmakers have ND ahead. I will be rooting for them to go 9-3 next year. Losses hopefully to IU, Purdue, and Ball State. 

 

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1 hour ago, BTF said:

Overall body of work. Michigan was the better team the night they played ND. Michigan might even win 8 of 10 against the Irish because of how they match up against them. But because ND got waxed by Michigan doesn't mean they would have lost to Wisconsin by 21. It doesn't mean they would lose to Penn State by 7. It doesn't mean they would have struggled against Army. 

Which team should have been ranked higher? That's debatable.Like I've said all season, 4-15 is a crapshoot. Michigan looked great in waxing ND and IU. They were impressive in beating Iowa. In big games though, they were 1-3 with all three losses being blowouts. Notre Dame at least put up a fight when they played at Georgia. Waxing Navy and Iowa State played in ND's favor among the voters. 

How will the Wolverines be next year? The media seems to love them at the beginning of the year...........every year. Early rankings for 2020 even have them ahead of the Irish. Although oddsmakers have ND ahead. I will be rooting for them to go 9-3 next year. Losses hopefully to IU, Purdue, and Ball State. 

 

I haven’t seen one media outlet high on Michigan next year as most are bullish due to being embarrassed annually.

My comment about Michigan/ND (and the others) was tongue in cheek.  I know there is not a 31 point difference between the schools as the argument could be made UM played its best game of the year the same day ND played its worst.

It happens.  But to suggest the “monsoon” affected one team more than the other is a bit far fetched.  
 

Michigan played SIX top 14 teams if you look at the final poll.  Criticism is warranted but not nearly as much piling on as the national media loves to do.

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14 hours ago, Temptation said:

The top 4 ENTERING bowl season, my mistake.

They are the only ones of EIGHTY teams that actually play in a meaningful bowl game.

I do agree with that but I am a big advocate of a 32 team tournament. Actually I would love to see two 32 team tournaments. 1 for the top 32 and another one for 32-64. I think that would do a few different things for college football. First it would take away the argument that "my team was better but they didn't get a shot." Second it would even out recruiting. they way it is now the best high school players want to go play at the schools that have a shot at the national championship. And the last thing it would allow for better games throughout the year. You could lose three or four games and still make the tourney. They way it is now if you lose 2 games you are out so you get to watch 70-3 blowouts and argue that your teams win was more convincing than your teams.  

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On 1/16/2020 at 7:30 PM, BTF said:

It's really just a measurement of how you did that season. I agree that it's good for recruiting. Some schools use it to tout how many top ten finishes they've recorded in the past "x" amount of years. I'm sure it means a ton to those directly involved in the program. For a school like Navy, finishing in the Top 25 is kind of a big deal. 

Nice couple of years for the academies.  This year final AP rankings had Navy 20th and Air Force 22nd. (both with 11 win seasons and bowl victories)

https://www.ncaa.com/rankings/football/fbs/associated-press

Last year final AP,  Army was 19th.  (11 win season and a bowl victory)

https://www.ncaa.com/news/football/article/2019-01-08/college-football-rankings-clemson-finishes-no-1-final-ap-poll

 

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