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Could SIAC Makeover push Duneland into expansion mode?

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Posted (edited)

https://www.courierpress.com/story/sports/high-school/2019/05/21/siac-add-vincennes-lincoln-and-jasper-amid-conference-reshuffling/3742346002/

Ive always felt that 10 schools is the optimum number for high school athletic conferences, and the SIACs addition of Jasper and Vincennes Lincoln pushes the league to that magic 10.

The Summit expanded to 10 with the addition of Homestead and Carroll several years ago.  

Could the Duneland be next?

Two fabulous schools are ripe for the picking should the DAC choose to expand to 10.

Munster and Penn.

Should Penn choose to take a pass, Andrean would be my first alternate.

The SIAC and the SAC are two of the best, most balanced conferences in the state.  They each have city, suburban and parochial schools on their league rosters. This creates great rivalries against schools of different size, demographic and socio economic makeup.  The DAC was once the most powerful football conference in the state.  The opportunity for the league to get back on the football radar is prime right now with two blue blood programs waiting in the wings.

Penn is aggressively moving to build its non con schedule, a strong hint that the school may be considering a  move to full independence.  The NICs loss of Mishawaka to the NLC is a huge blow.  

The Northwest Crossroads is a league that has morphed from the Calumet Conference to the Lake Suburban Conference to the Lake Athletic to the NCC over the past 5 decades.  The loss of Griffith shook up the league, and scheduling can be a real challenge with only 6 schools and 5 conference games.  I would think that Munster is keeping its options open as it is the most attractive acquisition target in the league.

As a long time fan of The DAC, I would like to see this expansion take place sooner than later.  Conferences around the state are making moves to strengthen their rosters.  MIshawaka has strengthened the NLC.  VL and Jasper will strengthen The SIAC.  Homestead and Carroll have taken the SAC to a new level.  The Hoosier Crossroads in Indy is not content with its second place perception behind The MIC.   Look for the HCC to make a run at several schools, including Columbus North, Center Grove, Whiteland or others.  

Gotta love conference expansion.

 

 

 

Edited by DT

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Any chance New Prairie goes to the Duneland? 

They are currently in the NIC North....with Mishawaka leaving and the rumor mill spinning about a Penn independence, the NIC could turn into a "last one out turn out the lights" conference. NP geographically makes the an outlier in every conference but still a possibility in a number of conferences.  

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I don't think crashing the Duneland's party will be that easy...

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On 5/22/2019 at 3:24 PM, Gipper said:

I don't think crashing the Duneland's party will be that easy...

There ain't much of a party happening in the Duneland lately, conference has been on the decline for years. I like the discussion/idea on possible addition of New Prairie and Penn. I think It would be tough for Penn though to travel close to an hour or more to some road games and NP is a up and coming program. Penn does gain an hour going there, but teams in Duneland playing at Penn lose an hour on game day. 

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, psaboy said:

There ain't much of a party happening in the Duneland lately, conference has been on the decline for years. I like the discussion/idea on possible addition of New Prairie and Penn. I think It would be tough for Penn though to travel close to an hour or more to some road games and NP is a up and coming program. Penn does gain an hour going there, but teams in Duneland playing at Penn lose an hour on game day. 

The answer is neutral site games.  Crown Point and Lake Central (the two most western DAC schools) could play Penn at Ames Field in Michigan City.  Great venue and a good central meeting point for the schools.  Possibly some Saturday afternoon ballgames.  

Edited by DT

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8 hours ago, DT said:

The answer is neutral site games.  Crown Point and Lake Central (the two most western DAC schools) could play Penn at Ames Field in Michigan City.  Great venue and a good central meeting point for the schools.  Possibly some Saturday afternoon ballgames.  

IMO, that is not a very attractive solution. 

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13 hours ago, psaboy said:

There ain't much of a party happening in the Duneland lately, conference has been on the decline for years. I like the discussion/idea on possible addition of New Prairie and Penn. I think It would be tough for Penn though to travel close to an hour or more to some road games and NP is a up and coming program. Penn does gain an hour going there, but teams in Duneland playing at Penn lose an hour on game day. 

Baseball and Soccer are REALLY good. Basketball fairly solid as well, but baseball and soccer can hold their own with any conference in the state. The commitment to football just isn't the same as it was in the '70's to '90's. Possibly because they lost a lot of legendary coaches and the replacements aren't filling the void. I have a feeling Gipper's comment has more to do with the Duneland feeling too superior to offer Munster, NP, Andrean, Griffith, etc. IMO, in their mind, it's Penn or bust. They wouldn't take Elkhart Central when Penn and Mishawaka were ready to join a couple of years back. Maybe they would take newly consolidated Elkhart if that was the only way they could get Penn. 

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I can't see any appetite from any of the DAC schools to add Penn to the conference.  The DAC likes being the big school conference for the "region" and adding a school from St. Joe county, let alone one that would be the big dog as soon as they got in, isn't going to be supported by any of the schools.  Also, going to a 10 team league would screw up lots of traditional rivalries that these schools like to maintain.  I don't see the DAC being interested in adding a private school like Andrean either.  There really isn't a whole lot for the DAC to gain by adding anyone.

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A lot of ADs see eight as the optimum number for a conference. 

Allows 7 football games, two non-con games, with no scheduling headaches because you can play noncon in Weeks 1-2 and conference games Weeks 3-9. 

Can play your conference basketball games on Fridays and spread them out throughout the year (or, for some leagues, B/G DHs in Dec/Jan). 

Allows for a double-round robin in baseball that only takes half the schedule. 

Ten makes the schedule a bit unwieldy. Six is too few. Any odd number creates headaches because someone is always going to be off. 

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1 hour ago, crimsonace1 said:

A lot of ADs see eight as the optimum number for a conference. 

Allows 7 football games, two non-con games, with no scheduling headaches because you can play noncon in Weeks 1-2 and conference games Weeks 3-9. 

Can play your conference basketball games on Fridays and spread them out throughout the year (or, for some leagues, B/G DHs in Dec/Jan). 

Allows for a double-round robin in baseball that only takes half the schedule. 

Ten makes the schedule a bit unwieldy. Six is too few. Any odd number creates headaches because someone is always going to be off. 

Then why have the SAC and the SIAC, arguably two of the very best conferences in the state, opted to go to 10 schools?

Dont be surprised to see the HCC be the next to expand. When CI finally blows up, the HCC and the Hoosier Hills will likely pick up the remnants. 

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12 minutes ago, DT said:

Then why have the SAC and the SIAC, arguably two of the very best conferences in the state, opted to go to 10 schools?

Dont be surprised to see the HCC be the next to expand. When CI finally blows up, the HCC and the Hoosier Hills will likely pick up the remnants. 

Why has the MIC, arguably the best conference in the Midwest, stayed at eight ... as have most other leagues? Even when the MIC added Pike & LC, it did so by shedding THN/THS. 

The SAC is basically a municipal conference. The SIAC is geographically isolated and have all of the big schools AND the p/ps who play at a big school level in that corner of the state. Once Jasper & Vincennes got hung out to dry with Mt. Carmel being forced to leave the Big 8 (thus leaving the league at five teams), those two schools were essentially left without a league. Adding them keeps travel headaches at a minimum since those are essentially the only large schools in the area. 

Of the two leagues you mention, the HCC is at eight schools and doesn't really have a need to expand at the moment. Who would it pick up? Terre Haute North/South, possibly, but they are geographic outliers. Unless the HCC splits up and the western schools (Brownsburg/Avon/Zionsville) decide to join the Terre Haute schools. 

Bloomington N/S & Columbus North would make sense for the Hoosier Hills for a lot of reasons, and that's something I could see happening IF the BCSC board would allow North & East in the same league. 

Right now, CI is six schools who really have no place else to go after losing Martinsville, Decatur Central & Perry Meridian to the Mid-State. If one finds a landing spot, that could cause some dominoes to fall. 

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32 minutes ago, crimsonace1 said:

Why has the MIC, arguably the best conference in the Midwest, stayed at eight ... as have most other leagues? Even when the MIC added Pike & LC, it did so by shedding THN/THS. 

The SAC is basically a municipal conference. The SIAC is geographically isolated and have all of the big schools AND the p/ps who play at a big school level in that corner of the state. Once Jasper & Vincennes got hung out to dry with Mt. Carmel being forced to leave the Big 8 (thus leaving the league at five teams), those two schools were essentially left without a league. Adding them keeps travel headaches at a minimum since those are essentially the only large schools in the area. 

Of the two leagues you mention, the HCC is at eight schools and doesn't really have a need to expand at the moment. Who would it pick up? Terre Haute North/South, possibly, but they are geographic outliers. Unless the HCC splits up and the western schools (Brownsburg/Avon/Zionsville) decide to join the Terre Haute schools. 

Bloomington N/S & Columbus North would make sense for the Hoosier Hills for a lot of reasons, and that's something I could see happening IF the BCSC board would allow North & East in the same league. 

Right now, CI is six schools who really have no place else to go after losing Martinsville, Decatur Central & Perry Meridian to the Mid-State. If one finds a landing spot, that could cause some dominoes to fall. 

I see CN heading north to the HCC.  Possibly with Center Grove or Cathedral.    BS and BN to the HHC.  Southport to the Circle City.  THN and S to fend for themselves.  

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2 hours ago, DT said:

Southport to the Circle City.

Can you expand your reasoning behind this? Why would Southport (a 6A school) want to join a conference with 1(4A) school, 3 (3A) schools, 1 (2A) school and 1 (1A) school? Generally curious here.

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2 hours ago, NLCTigerFan07 said:

Can you expand your reasoning behind this? Why would Southport (a 6A school) want to join a conference with 1(4A) school, 3 (3A) schools, 1 (2A) school and 1 (1A) school? Generally curious here.

Southport has a long competitive history against the parochial schools in the Circle City. Southport certainly doesn't compete like a typical 6a program.  Southport is also blocked from the Mid State as Perry Meridian does not want to share conference affiliation with its Southside neighbor.  I believe they land in the CC when Conf Indiana disbands.    

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22 hours ago, slicer28 said:

I can't see any appetite from any of the DAC schools to add Penn to the conference.  The DAC likes being the big school conference for the "region" and adding a school from St. Joe county, let alone one that would be the big dog as soon as they got in, isn't going to be supported by any of the schools.  Also, going to a 10 team league would screw up lots of traditional rivalries that these schools like to maintain.  I don't see the DAC being interested in adding a private school like Andrean either.  There really isn't a whole lot for the DAC to gain by adding anyone.

just as I had contended...

On ‎5‎/‎24‎/‎2019 at 6:37 AM, psaboy said:

IMO, that is not a very attractive solution. 

I agree.

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Hey Center Grove, you might as well give up and join the HCC.  That way DT can start all his posts out with something different.

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On ‎5‎/‎29‎/‎2019 at 3:50 PM, Staxawax said:

Hey Center Grove, you might as well give up and join the HCC.  That way DT can start all his posts out with something different.

so I guess they're not a contraction candidate?

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14 minutes ago, Gipper said:

so I guess they're not a contraction candidate?

No but South Newton certainly is

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Just now, DT said:

No but South Newton certainly is

says who?

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1 hour ago, Gipper said:

says who?

The Contraction Czar, resistance is futile. You will be assimilated, strike that, contracted!

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1 hour ago, Gipper said:

Oh yeah, forgot about that schlub...

I shouldn't resort to name calling, but that's tired rhetoric I don't care for.  SN is down, we all know that.  Conversely, the same Rebel team played in the Semi-state a few years ago.  SN football is cyclical and is great social activity for the residents of Kentland, Goodland, and Brook.  Case closed.

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On ‎5‎/‎22‎/‎2019 at 1:58 PM, SBFootball1 said:

Any chance New Prairie goes to the Duneland? 

They are currently in the NIC North....with Mishawaka leaving and the rumor mill spinning about a Penn independence, the NIC could turn into a "last one out turn out the lights" conference. NP geographically makes the an outlier in every conference but still a possibility in a number of conferences.  

Since they obviously won't be contracted, NP could fit in the DAC as they are in the proper time zone.  But would the old guard let them in?  My Spidey Senses tell me no.

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