Crown Point (13-0) vs. Ben Davis (12-1) 6A State Championship

[BTF]

1 minute ago, BDGiant93 said:

Warren Central/Ben Davis is a rivalry game, but you have a point. LC played BD very hard too. 

Brownsburg or Center Grove could be playing this week. They were both good enough. Cathedral was too. But...they aren't. The other team in that echelon is...Ben Davis.

I expect we'll see a competitive game on Saturday. This BD team is really good though at full strength, and they are right now. Crown Point can't let them get in automatic mode like they have been a few times this year...where everything is working.

I think Ben Davis has a great team this year. I still think it's a tragedy that two nationally ranked teams had to play each other in the first round. No matter who has who ranked ahead of the other, I think both Ben Davis and Brownsburg deserve any accolades a poster is willing to give them. 

[temptation]

14 minutes ago, BDGiant93 said:

Warren Central/Ben Davis is a rivalry game, but you have a point. LC played BD very hard too. 

Brownsburg or Center Grove could be playing this week. They were both good enough. Cathedral was too. But...they aren't. The other team in that echelon is...Ben Davis.

I expect we'll see a competitive game on Saturday. This BD team is really good though at full strength, and they are right now. Crown Point can't let them get in automatic mode like they have been a few times this year...where everything is working.

I know you likely know the BD program better than anyone else on this forum but can I flip the script a bit?

Is this just PC level coach speak on your part?  What makes you think Crown Point will be able to do what only two (Penn in 2015 and Snider in 2004) schools have been able to do in the last 20+ years?

History is not on Crown Point’s side.

Edited November 20, 2023 by temptation

[hhpatriot04]

What's the state of high level, big school football in Indiana? Are we still competitive in the Midwest? What about vs. neighbors like Ohio, Kentucky and Michigan? 

[temptation]

7 minutes ago, hhpatriot04 said:

What's the state of high level, big school football in Indiana? Are we still competitive in the Midwest? What about vs. neighbors like Ohio, Kentucky and Michigan? 

There is an entire thread diminishing the accomplishments of a 4A team despite the fact that they (and two other Indiana schools) defeated a team still alive in the final four of Ohio’s largest class this weekend.

And Ohio is undoubtedly a top 5 state for high school football nationwide in my opinion.

That answer your question?

Edited November 20, 2023 by temptation

[FastpacedO]

14 minutes ago, hhpatriot04 said:

What's the state of high level, big school football in Indiana? Are we still competitive in the Midwest? What about vs. neighbors like Ohio, Kentucky and Michigan? 

Considering Ben Davis and Center Grove (along with East Central) beat up Moeller in Ohio Div 1 and Moeller will play in the State Semi-Finals against Springfield for a chance to play the winner of St. Edwards vs Hilliard Bradley. Not too bad against Ohio. That being said Center Grove did get handled pretty easily by St. Edward's.

St. Edward's only blemish was a 15-13 loss to Ohio Div 2 and undefeated Massillon Washington in Massillon.

As for Kentucky Boyle County played no Indiana opponents Trinity played Carmel but it was a very down year for Carmel. One of the teams Frederick Douglas that is in the 6A semi-finals lost to Cathedral in Lexington 28-19.

I don't know that there were any meaningful Michigan vs Indiana games.

[temptation]

40 minutes ago, temptation said:

I know you likely know the BD program better than anyone else on this forum but can I flip the script a bit?

Is this just PC level coach speak on your part?  What makes you think Crown Point will be able to do what only two (Penn in 2015 and Snider in 2004) schools have been able to do in the last 20+ years?

History is not on Crown Point’s side.

I know @Bash Riprock hates numbers but since the turn of the century, there have been 11 Indy vs non-Indy area state finals matchups in the state’s largest class and the average margin of victory is 32.8 points per game.

In fact, you have to go all the way back to 1996 to find a state finals contest in the state’s largest class that has finished with a one possession final score in such a contest.

Crown Point is likely just the next victim.

Edited November 20, 2023 by temptation

[BTF]

3 minutes ago, temptation said:

I know @Bash Riprock hates numbers but since the turn of the century, there have been 11 Indy vs non-Indy area state finals matchups in the state’s largest class and the average margin of victory is 32.8 points per game.

In fact, you have to go all the way back to 1996 to find a state finals contest in the state’s largest class that has finished with a one possession final score in such a contest.

Crown Point is likely just the next victim.

Two competitive games and four blowouts?

[temptation]

11 minutes ago, BTF said:

Two competitive games and four blowouts?

I’ll say 3/3, I know little about the 2A teams.

 

[BTF]

Just now, temptation said:

I’ll say 3/3, I know little about the 2A teams.

 

I was referring to 6A north over the last 20 years. 

 

[BDGiant93]

23 minutes ago, temptation said:

I know @Bash Riprock hates numbers but since the turn of the century, there have been 11 Indy vs non-Indy area state finals matchups in the state’s largest class and the average margin of victory is 32.8 points per game.

In fact, you have to go all the way back to 1996 to find a state finals contest in the state’s largest class that has finished with a one possession final score in such a contest.

Crown Point is likely just the next victim.

1996 🤬

1 hour ago, temptation said:

I know you likely know the BD program better than anyone else on this forum but can I flip the script a bit?

Is this just PC level coach speak on your part?  What makes you think Crown Point will be able to do what only two (Penn in 2015 and Snider in 2004) schools have been able to do in the last 20+ years?

History is not on Crown Point’s side.

Westfield was a big underdog and nearly pulled off the win too...I know...not really a northern team.

I don't know how to quantify it. I'm just looking at what Crown Point has done. They're destroying people they should destroy. I think Coach Buzea is a good football coach. I'm trying to give them credit for what they've done. I don't think folks should think this is going to be 63-14 again. Of course, if I'm wrong, I'd be happy to have you point it out.

Edited November 20, 2023 by BDGiant93

[temptation]

3 minutes ago, BDGiant93 said:

1996 🤬

Westfield was a big underdog and nearly pulled off the win too...I know...not really a northern team.

I don't know how to quantify it. I'm just looking at what Crown Point has done. They're destroying people they should destroy. I think Coach Buzea is a good football coach. I'm trying to give them credit for what they've done. I don't think folks should think this is going to be 63-14 again. Of course, if I'm wrong, I'd be happy to have you point it out.

Another data point, Cathedral curb stomped Penn, BD eliminated Cathedral and Crown Point was a blocked FG away from losing to Penn.

I’m slowly talking myself into 63-14.

Edited November 20, 2023 by temptation

[PDB26]

27 minutes ago, temptation said:

In fact, you have to go all the way back to 1996 to find a state finals contest in the state’s largest class that has finished with a one possession final score in such a contest.

Crown Point is likely just the next victim.

Hey, if you're going to go back to '96 then maybe there's an infinitesimally small chance of a 2000 repeat.

1 minute ago, BDGiant93 said:

I don't know how to quantify it. I'm just looking at what Crown Point has done. They're destroying people they should destroy. I think Coach Buzea is a good football coach. I'm trying to give them credit for what they've done. I don't think folks should think this is going to be 63-14 again. Of course, if I'm wrong, I'd be happy to have you point it out.

If Crown Point played the pass better I'd entertain the concept of them leaning on their line and mucking it up, but Ben Davis has to be too prolific moving the ball through the air, right? Maybe it's not 63-14, but I think Ben Davis's number is 42. So, can Crown Point keep up enough to make it interesting and force a mistake or two out of the Giants? 

[hhpatriot04]

Man... TGD is cooking with gas! 

[BTF]

18 minutes ago, temptation said:

Another data point, Cathedral curb stomped Penn, BD eliminated Cathedral and Crown Point was a blocked FG away from losing to Penn.

I’m slowly talking myself into 63-14.

Lol, 49 points? I'll take Crown Point for $2000. You in?

[SIR IRISH]

14 minutes ago, BTF said:

Lol, 49 points? I'll take Crown Point for $2000. You in?

I tend to agree.  I will go with 42-14 but I think it will be a running clock.  Lets not forget, Brownsburg smashed Westfield by 30 earlier this year.... so not sure how good Westfield was.  I know that BD is really good, and fast.  Not many weaknesses on that team.

[BTF]

1 hour ago, SIR IRISH said:

I tend to agree.  I will go with 42-14 but I think it will be a running clock.  Lets not forget, Brownsburg smashed Westfield by 30 earlier this year.... so not sure how good Westfield was.  I know that BD is really good, and fast.  Not many weaknesses on that team.

No running clock in the state finals. Won't matter. At the very most, Ben Davis could turn it on and win by 21. But that's best case scenario for the Giants. 

[temptation]

9 minutes ago, BTF said:

No running clock in the state finals. Won't matter. At the very most, Ben Davis could turn it on and win by 21. But that's best case scenario for the Giants. 

I’ll take -21.5.

[BTF]

8 minutes ago, temptation said:

I’ll take -21.5.

PM me to work out the details.

[GS54]

2 hours ago, FastpacedO said:

Considering Ben Davis and Center Grove (along with East Central) beat up Moeller in Ohio Div 1 and Moeller will play in the State Semi-Finals against Springfield for a chance to play the winner of St. Edwards vs Hilliard Bradley. Not too bad against Ohio. That being said Center Grove did get handled pretty easily by St. Edward's.

St. Edward's only blemish was a 15-13 loss to Ohio Div 2 and undefeated Massillon Washington in Massillon.

As for Kentucky Boyle County played no Indiana opponents Trinity played Carmel but it was a very down year for Carmel. One of the teams Frederick Douglas that is in the 6A semi-finals lost to Cathedral in Lexington 28-19.

I don't know that there were any meaningful Michigan vs Indiana games.

Boyle County defeated Gibson Southern in week 1

[SIR IRISH]

2 hours ago, BTF said:

No running clock in the state finals. Won't matter. At the very most, Ben Davis could turn it on and win by 21. But that's best case scenario for the Giants. 

Disagree...and I will gladly eat crow on Sunday if I am wrong but I am not.

[temptation]

2 hours ago, BTF said:

PM me to work out the details.

Nah, you’ve done enough my man.

[hhpatriot04]

Loser has to give the winner a one year #TGD membership, or are we bordering on amateur athletics gambling (if that's even possible in the NIL era?).

[FastpacedO]

9 hours ago, GS54 said:

Boyle County defeated Gibson Southern in week 1

You are correct they did. However I thought he was asking about big schools in Indiana.

[BTF]

5 hours ago, hhpatriot04 said:

Loser has to give the winner a one year #TGD membership, or are we bordering on amateur athletics gambling (if that's even possible in the NIL era?).

I think that's been done in the past by some members. 

And for the record, when someone throws out there the suggestion of money, I don't think it's really intended to be taken seriously. The amount just simply shows how strong one feels about something. For instance, 2k would be equal to a 9 on a 10 point scale. 

[BTF]

7 hours ago, temptation said:

Nah, you’ve done enough my man.

Gentlemen's bet. I'll give you the 21.5. Wasn't Crown Point up on Westfield 17-0 at one point? Honest question, because I'm not sure. I think they were up 17 regardless of the score. Brownsburg is the only team that's done that to them all year up until that point.