Lysander

….and Snider isn’t already? 5A is the literal “short bus” of Indiana HS football.

“Snider is relevant….almost every year.” Not sure I can add to that. Nothing like being relevant.

Err….I’m just looking SOLELY at CalPreps (I kind of rule out Sagarin these days). Chatard is in the mix as a Top 10 team….it’s rare that a 5A team even sniffs that Top 10 is unless it’s a bumped 4A. Regardless, the best Chatard can claim is 3A Champ…if they are so fortunate to do so. I will admit some degree of bitterness as regards Snider because I pick them year after year, after year, after year, after year…ad nauseam to win 5A . Outside of here, I oft complain to my football buddies that I listen too much to the Ft. Wayne fanboys when I pick Snider year after year……..AFTER YEAR. To a point, unless a 4A team is involved, one just generally need show up to win 5A. Still amazed Snider hasn’t actually been able to push up to 6A. It’s been 11 years at this point….in the easiest Class in the State. ……and yet I pick Snider EVERY darn year. Dude, you should be thanking me for supporting a losing cause.

They are, almost undoubtedly, the best team from 1A - 5A. We all pretty well know that much...at minimum (maybe Chatard might throw some shade) but I, legitimately, think they are one of the Top 2-3 teams in Indiana this year. Admittedly, they can only and potentially ever be 4A Champ. With that, for the record, its hardly assumptive that 6A represents the best team in the State by default. God forbid, we already know 5A rarely is the best team between 3A-5A..proved particularly in those 70% of the time years when a 4A team wins in 5A.

Heritage Hills is, frankly, one of the greatest 3A programs in Indiana HS football history. Anyone unaware or disrespectful of this, is apparently one of those "expert" Facebook posters....or much worse. With that, this is a pretty darn good Chatard team. Although known for their defense, they scored 4 TDs - 28 pts on only 9 offensive plays v. Knox and 35 pts on 14 offensive plays v. Knox prior to half time.

Everyone assumes another 4A sized INDY school (Cathedral) can arguably be the best team in the State almost ANNUALLY but hardly anyone is willing to grant that another 4A sized school (East Central) which is actually a Cincinnati suburban school (when you drill down just a bit....where some of the best football in the country is played) can't EVER possibly be the best team in Indiana...or, at least, contend for it. Let's be clear, CalPreps has them #2 in Indiana currently. 4A New Pal was more than likely the best team in the state just a few short years ago - Indy suburbs. God forbid a smaller school outside of the Indy metro might be any good. Most everything I read here (and from the peanut brains on Facebook) reflects the overall myopia towards 6A, Indy, Ft.Wayne and the Region (God forbid). An added irony is that those in the Cincy Metro most likely chuckle at we Indiana hayseeds when we scoff that a Cincy suburban team...the best team in the Cincy tri-state (who's address just happens to be in Indiana) somehow just doesn't measure up.

42-14 Chatard Final

Chatard 42 Knox 14 3:06 left in 4th

Chatard 35 Knox 0 Half Chatard will be receiving at the start of the 3rd Q

I think Lakota knocked out Elder last week.

Me too.

I think the justification for only needing 1 point to stay up is, generally, that if you are good enough to win a Sectional 50% of the time (once per 2 year cycle) thereby earning 1 point over a 2 year period then that would seem to demonstrate your ability to compete effectively in that class. Again, just my opinion.

I thought it was 4 points originally to stay up…..then moved down to 2.

He’s like Taylor Swift over on Facebook.

So your read on it (I have yet to closely read it) is that it “rolls” year to year and if over ANY two year period a team acquires 6 points they will bump up the following year. If so, that is a very good change. I do think, though, that they should have decreased the number to stay “up” to 1 point rather than increase it to 3 points. As big of a deal as all of this is I’m still just gobsmacked it’s been so seemingly under the radar until now.

….and it’s not always like this every time the two “C” word Indy P/Ps are in the subject heading? It’s looking more like Facebook here every day.

Hmmmm….odd that the IHSAA seems to have quietly changed it to 3 points this time around. I’m sure it’s a coincidence.

Kind of earthshaking for it to have been changed with so little ballyhoo. I know you may disagree but I thought it should have gone in the other direction.

I’m not necessarily arguing with you as much as I’m positing a question myself. It can’t solely be explained by student body makeup alone when all the other sports are VERY normal. Maybe it’s all about emphasis. With that, I wholly disagree with a mandatory bump in all sports. The “targeting” of the Success Factor strikes me as the best way…it just needs more refining and the IHSAA needs to factor it into Sectional makeup. I’d start there. The mandatory bump strikes me as overly simplistic and unfair to other sports AND unfair to P/Ps that aren’t that extraordinary in ANY sport. It’s a sledgehammer in place of a scalpel. I think it was Tom Sowell that saiid, “There are no solutions. There are only trade-offs.”

Looks like it changed. Someone told me that a few weeks ago and I told them, “No way.” Guess I should have read it.

So you really think the administrators and parents who often struggle financially to keep the doors open (the LCC story is a remarkable one in that regard) are going to leave empty seats in the school because of a ridiculous IHSAA Class designation? Catholic schools can’t make it without parents lending a literal “physical” hand let alone leave seats empty. You really can’t imagine how little Bill Sahm, President at Chatard, could care about what Class the football team is in. If we can’t get past simply wrong (verging on ridiculous) assertions like this then there’s no hope for ever having any meaningful conversation.

“Thank You” (I’m out of emojis). CYO teams are tiny in numbers on the team compared to their public counterparts but are many in the number of teams. The result of that is: 1. Much more personalized coaching because of the generally greater ratio of coaches to players. 2. Much more playing time because of the smaller number of players….which, among other things, keeps kids engaged in the sport. Keeping kids engaged in the game is critical in CYO…and in Catholic Freshman football. 3. A multitude of position players when they arrive in HS. If there are 30 small CYO teams, then there are 60 QBs. One of the most prolific QBs ever at Cathedral was the second QB from his CYO team when he arrived at Cathedral as a Freshman. I don’t quarrel much with folks when they point out that there is ON THE WHOLE a different kid roaming the halls (with different parents as importantly) on P/Ps v. Publics that often have many who are there solely because they are directed to be but I will leave you all with a question. If the difference is solely the type of kid (more driven/motivated, more athletic…either or both) then why aren’t the halls of Chatard (since this conversation is, momentarily, focused on Chatard) simply replete with Basketball, Soccer, Baseball, etc. State Championship hardware? It has been, rightfully, noted here that a certain 3A team generally looks forward to wrestling matches v. Chatard. Other teams look forward generally to hoops games, etc. v. Chatard. Chatard Boys generally do ONE sport remarkably well….but are absolutely normal at best in most everything else. As regards football….something else or in addition must be at play. PS - I wrote this before reading @tango’s post which I think is very insightful. “Thank you” (still out of emojis).

I think that amounts to 3 points based on the way the IHSAA score keeps. Each progressive playoff victory, commencing with the Sectional Champuonship, adds another single point. A Regional Championship adds 1 point to the 1 point from the Sectional Championship previously acquired for a running total of 2 points in totality you’ve earned if you win Regional. That said, one change I’d suggest to the whole Success Factor dynamic is that the number of points required to stay up be reduced to 1…rather than 2.

Chatard played EC during the regular season for a few years in a row just a few years back. Frankly, between New Pal, Roncalli, Memorial, Reitz and Brebeuf any of them could win the South in 4A over Chatard. Not to mention any number of other teams could rise. 4A South is a bear. Cathedral is dropping down to 5A? Haven't they earned the prerequisite 2 points to stay up in 6A?

Could be wrong but I'm pretty sure when Coach Doyle was running the Chatard Freshmen program prior to his becoming head coach that they didn't even run the varsity offense and defense. My understanding was that they were serious and disciplined but really wanted to make it as fun as possible in order to retain kids in the sport.