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NFL COMMISSIONER ROGER GOODELL COULD INTERVENE ON THE OUTCOME OF THE RAMS VS. SAINTS GAME

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https://dailycaller.com/2019/01/21/commissioner-roger-goodell-rams-saints-pass-interference-reschedule-rule-17/

 

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Consider Rule 17, Section 2, Article 3: “The Commissioner’s powers under this Section 2 include . . . the reversal of a game’s result or the rescheduling of a game, either from the beginning or from the point at which the extraordinary act occurred.”

Basically, the Commissioner has the power to turn back time to the spot of the penalty that wasn’t called, put the teams back on the field from that point in the game, give the Saints first and goal at the spot of the foul, put 1:49 on the clock, and let the game proceed, tied at 20, with the Rams having one time out left.

 

 

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18 minutes ago, GB4 said:

Pass interference reviews in the future?

GB 

I wouldn't be surprised. Be ready for an updated definition of PI similar to the catch/no catch rule. Careful what you ask for.

I'm also guessing the calamity rule the NFL has is more for something intentional and outlandish. Like they discovered an entire team got sick during the game because someone gave them rotten food. An incorrect judgement call (regardless of how incorrect) is not a reason to enact this rule. No matter what they do with replay or technology there will still be people involved and there will still be errors. Even when calls are correct fans will complain. There is no way to avoid that.

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Personally I feel like this year the refs have been better about PI calls. They let the players play and make no calls if it’s both....but the missed saints call is rough. 

 

I don’t want reviewable penalties. But I feel like there should be a backdoor to this. Idk. Maybe a penalty challenge. 

 

The proposed challenge could only be used once and the coach has to specifically name the penalty that was missed or incorrectly called. 

 

Just an idea. Obviously there are flaws to this idea too

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The only thing that will end this never-ending debate is to let go of the expectation of perfection. Doesn’t mean officials should stop trying to get every call right. It means coaches, players, fans, media, etc., should stop expecting them to get every call right ... and expressing outrage when they don’t.  Officiating has been a huge part of my life for 40+ years, and I can tell you the mechanics, clinics, instructional materials, and other aids to improvement are far, far better now than they were even 20 yrs. ago. The officiating product is correspondingly much better than it was. Yet dissatisfaction with officiating is greater than ever. The reason: technology has changed expectations. Seeing all those camera angles, slo-mo and stop action replays have changed expectations. After all, it looks so easy, the calls so obvious ... even though it iisn’t and they aren’t. The more we expect perfection from human beings, the less likely we are to be satisfied, even when the officiating product approaches the limits of human performance, which is where I believe the NFL is now.  You are not going to find better officials than we have in the NFL. You can keep trying to improve the selection process and the training. But that will result in marginal improvement at best, because it is already just about as good as you’re going to get from the human performance standpoint.

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They have a lot that are full time as it stands if I am not mistaken, not all.

Why cannot their be a system in place where central command center BUZZES the Official that their is an issue, go to sideline, give the on field official the ruling immediately and move on.   Should take less than 2 mins.

I believe NHL has something similar 

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1 hour ago, Bobref said:

The only thing that will end this never-ending debate is to let go of the expectation of perfection. Doesn’t mean officials should stop trying to get every call right. It means coaches, players, fans, media, etc., should stop expecting them to get every call right ... and expressing outrage when they don’t.  Officiating has been a huge part of my life for 40+ years, and I can tell you the mechanics, clinics, instructional materials, and other aids to improvement are far, far better now than they were even 20 yrs. ago. The officiating product is correspondingly much better than it was. Yet dissatisfaction with officiating is greater than ever. The reason: technology has changed expectations. Seeing all those camera angles, slo-mo and stop action replays have changed expectations. After all, it looks so easy, the calls so obvious ... even though it iisn’t and they aren’t. The more we expect perfection from human beings, the less likely we are to be satisfied, even when the officiating product approaches the limits of human performance, which is where I believe the NFL is now.  You are not going to find better officials than we have in the NFL. You can keep trying to improve the selection process and the training. But that will result in marginal improvement at best, because it is already just about as good as you’re going to get from the human performance standpoint.

Could there be a way in incorporate the technology into officiating? Mike Florio was in The Pat McAfee Show and he was suggesting that the NFL add an official that is looking at all the screens and angles and is able to communicate and help on some calls. Personally, I think missed calls will happen and I don't generally get upset at the officiating but, that missed PI is pretty egregious. I don't necessarily think they need to change everything, but I do think embracing the technology in some way would not be a bad idea.

GB

Edited by GB4

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7 minutes ago, LaSalle Lions 1976 said:

Does anyone think this will lead the NFL to hire their officials on a full time basis?

 

 

Probably ... as a PR move. But it won’t change the quality of the officiating product. The NFL started hiring full time officials in 2017,, and I believe there are currently 21 out of a staff of 121..

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24 minutes ago, Coach Nowlin said:

They have a lot that are full time as it stands if I am not mistaken, not all.

Why cannot their be a system in place where central command center BUZZES the Official that their is an issue, go to sideline, give the on field official the ruling immediately and move on.   Should take less than 2 mins.

I believe NHL has something similar 

With perhaps a dozen games going on simultaneously?

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23 hours ago, DK_Barons said:

Now two upset saints fans our suing to force Goodell to use that rule:

https://www.foxnews.com/sports/new-orleans-ticketholders-sue-nfl-over-call-in-nfc-championship-game

Quote

Two New Orleans Saints season-ticket holders filed a lawsuit against the NFL on Tuesday, asking a Louisiana state court judge to order Commissioner Roger Goodell to invoke an obscure rule that could force the final moments of Sunday's NFC Championship game to be replayed. No penalty was called after Rams defensive back Nickell Robey-Coleman hit Saints receiver Tommylee Lewis while a Drew Brees pass was in the air with fewer than two minutes remaining in a tie game. A flag for pass interference would have given the Saints a first down and enabled them to run down the clock before kicking a potential game-winning field goal. Instead, New Orleans kicked a go-ahead field goal to take a 23-20 lead with 1:41 left. The Rams responded with a late field goal of their own and went on to win, 26-23, in overtime. Robey-Coleman later admitted to reporters that his hit on Lewis constituted pass interference, while Saints head coach Sean Payton said the NFL office acknowledged the missed call to him after the game. Referee Bill Vinovich told a pool reporter that the play in question was "a judgment call by the officials" and added that he had not seen what happened. SAINTS OWNER SAYS TEAM WAS 'UNFAIRLY DEPRIVED BY MISSED CALL IN NFC TITLE GAME According to Rule 17, Section 2, Article 1 of the NFL rulebook, the league commissioner "has the sole authority to investigate and take appropriate disciplinary and/or corrective measures if any club action, non-participant interference, or calamity occurs in an NFL game which the Commissioner deems so extraordinarily unfair or outside the accepted tactics encountered in professional football that such action has a major effect on the result of the game." Remedies include reversal of a game's result or the rescheduling of a game -- in its entirety or from the point when the act occurred. "Why is the rule there if it's not going to be implemented?" asked attorney Frank D'Amico, who filed the suit in state Civil District Court in New Orleans on behalf of Tommy Badeaux and Candis Lambert. PETITION URGES NFL TO FIRE OFFICIATING CREW AT CENTER OF NFC CHAMPIONSHIP CONTROVERSY The NFL did not immediately respond to requests for comment. The question is whether an officiating mistake -- even an egregious one -- is the type of "club action, non-participant interference, or calamity" that merits the remedy D'Amico's clients seek. Mike Pereira is among the doubters. CLICK HERE TO GET THE FOX NEWS APP "I understand the frustration," the former vice president of officiating for the NFL, now a Fox Sports analyst, told The Associated Press in an interview. But, he doesn't believe the rule applies in this case. A hearing is tentatively set for Monday -- six days before the Rams meet the New England Patriots in the Super Bowl in Atlanta.

 

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6 hours ago, Bobref said:

With perhaps a dozen games going on simultaneously?

Looked at upcoming Hockey Schedule:   Feb. 2nd:  There are 9hockey games on at one time.  Starting from 6pm to 8 p.m.  


There are some potential of overlap from 12 games to 3 pm games to get that number you of 12 you threw out there, but a simple adjustment to schedules.  12 noon and 3:30 instead of 3 pm. could ease your concern, that is one option.  

Another is man your central command center with enough bodies to cover them ALL .   It is not like the NFL isn't flush with cash to make that happen.  

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There is a sportsbook in Jersey that is refunding bets made on the game.

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The theory - being freely reported as “fact” here and many other places — is absolutely wrong. Not only will it not happen ... it CAN’T happen.  This, and several other widely reported myths about the NFC championship game debunked here:

http://www.footballzebras.com/2019/01/commissioner-can-issue-a-rule-17-overturn-of-saints-loss-and-other-myths-from-championship-sunday/

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On 1/22/2019 at 11:25 AM, Bobref said:

The only thing that will end this never-ending debate is to let go of the expectation of perfection. Doesn’t mean officials should stop trying to get every call right. It means coaches, players, fans, media, etc., should stop expecting them to get every call right ... and expressing outrage when they don’t.  Officiating has been a huge part of my life for 40+ years, and I can tell you the mechanics, clinics, instructional materials, and other aids to improvement are far, far better now than they were even 20 yrs. ago. The officiating product is correspondingly much better than it was. Yet dissatisfaction with officiating is greater than ever. The reason: technology has changed expectations. Seeing all those camera angles, slo-mo and stop action replays have changed expectations. After all, it looks so easy, the calls so obvious ... even though it iisn’t and they aren’t. The more we expect perfection from human beings, the less likely we are to be satisfied, even when the officiating product approaches the limits of human performance, which is where I believe the NFL is now.  You are not going to find better officials than we have in the NFL. You can keep trying to improve the selection process and the training. But that will result in marginal improvement at best, because it is already just about as good as you’re going to get from the human performance standpoint.

Bob, I don't disagree where you are going....but in the case of the Saints/Rams non-call on PI....this one was pretty dang basic.  DB arrived way early...never turned his head to play the ball....and went helmet to helmet.  There is a difference with expecting perfection, and getting more obvious calls correct.  There should have been multiple flags.  This one was egregious.  

While expecting perfection is a bit much, I do think we should expect better from an official working in the National Football League.

Serious question...isn't the NFL one of the last remaining pro sports not to have full time officials?  If that is correct, is it time to look hard at this?  I would rather see officials with more reps and work in the off season honing their craft than seeing more replays.  (my opinion only)

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26 minutes ago, TrojanDad said:

Bob, I don't disagree where you are going....but in the case of the Saints/Rams non-call on PI....this one was pretty dang basic.  DB arrived way early...never turned his head to play the ball....and went helmet to helmet.  There is a difference with expecting perfection, and getting more obvious calls correct.  There should have been multiple flags.  This one was egregious.  

While expecting perfection is a bit much, I do think we should expect better from an official working in the National Football League.

Serious question...isn't the NFL one of the last remaining pro sports not to have full time officials?  If that is correct, is it time to look hard at this?  I would rather see officials with more reps and work in the off season honing their craft than seeing more replays.  (my opinion only)

Knowing several NFL officials ... and what they had to do to get there and stay there, my own opinion is that hiring officials on a full time basis will not noticeably improve the quality of the product. But the NFL started hiring full time officials in 2017, and they now comprise about 16% of the staff. However, I have not heard of any plan to replace retiring officials with full timers until the staff is 100% employees.thnn   C

i don’t think anyone would characterize that DPI no-call as anything other than an egregious mistake. I’m certainly not advocating that there be no consequences. But that official has spent years and years getting to the position where he excelled even in the rarified air of NFL officiating.To call for his ouster on the basis of that one call is senseless.

Edited by Bobref

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37 minutes ago, Bobref said:

Knowing several NFL officials ... and what they had to do to get there and stay there, my own opinion is that hiring officials on a full time basis will not noticeably improve the quality of the product. But the NFL started hiring full time officials in 2017, and they now comprise about 16% of the staff. However, I have not heard of any plan to replace retiring officials with full timers until the staff is 100% employees.thnn   C

i don’t think anyone would characterize that DPI no-call as anything other than an egregious mistake. I’m certainly not advocating that there be no consequences. But that official has spent years and years getting to the position where he excelled even in the rarified air of NFL officiating.To call for his ouster on the basis of that one call is senseless.

No disagreement Bob....I don't think one play should lead to an ouster...should be a body of work that determines success or lack thereof.  But, we are a society that tends to swing the pendulum from one side to the next.....

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The only reason the other leagues have full time officials and the NFL doesn't is they have games every day of the week throughout their season. You can't easily have another job during your season. That's different with the NFL. There are no other games for them to work during the week. They spend at least 15-20 hours Monday-Friday reviewing game film, training videos, rules quizzes, crew and position teleconferences, etc. In the offseason they are attending camps and clinics often in a teaching capacity to college and high school officials. I agree with bobref I don't think you'll see a significant difference in performance (they are already right 98% of the time) by hiring them to be full time. Some of these guys make more money from their full time gig than their officiating gig (especially the new guys) so they would have to significantly increase the pay to make them all full time. The old saying "the juice probably isn't worth the squeeze" applies. I think they are using some of the full time guys now to put together training videos and other materials. I believe 2 of the guys working the Rams-Saints game are full-time officials.

As for the missed PI call, there are just times where your eyes fool you. That bad of a miss very rarely happens. Maybe a couple times a season. Other "misses" are often very close judgement calls that may only be wrong if you slow it down to watch frame by frame (i.e. some of the catch/no catch calls in the Chiefs-Patriots game). The beauty of football (sports in general) is they aren't perfect. The ball bounces funny. The QB misreads a defender. The receiver slips on his cut. The running back fumbles when he's hit. The coach goes for it on 4th and 2 from his own 28. The defender lines up in the neutral zone. This isn't precision engineering on an airplane. The officials strive to do their very best and the guys working in the NFL are amazing at what they do. But they aren't immune to criticism and it's deserved for that one call.

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3 minutes ago, TrojanDad said:

No disagreement Bob....I don't think one play should lead to an ouster...should be a body of work that determines success or lack thereof.  But, we are a society that tends to swing the pendulum from one side to the next.....

Another official gave me a great analogy. You are part of a sales team and you've received a request for a proposal for one of the largest contracts you could ever get (conference championship assignment). The due date comes and goes because you forgot to make a note of it (inexcusable error for someone normally really good). If you had bid on it your firm very likely gets it because you are the best in the industry and you are one of the top sales people (top 3 official at your position to be assigned to this game). That's a big financial loss for your company (huge PR nightmare for the NFL but not a financial loss for the league).

Are you fired over that one mistake? Probably not because of your proven success in doing the role. If you are a newer sales guy or one that hasn't performed well you likely weren't given that lead just like a newer or lower rated official wouldn't have been given that assignment. The 3 officials involved in that call were rated in the top 3 over the course of the season and had previously worked multiple playoff games including 2 Super Bowls. They just had a really bad, very public error at the most unfortunate time of a critical game.

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The owners passed a rule allowing PI calls and non PI calls to be reviewable.

GB 

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I am guessing a LOT of bad publicity made them change their minds??? The owners were dead set against this just one day ago, according to the many "insiders" for the various networks.

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1 hour ago, Irishman said:

I am guessing a LOT of bad publicity made them change their minds??? The owners were dead set against this just one day ago, according to the many "insiders" for the various networks.

I am assuming on a missed PI that is challenged, it will have to be really egregious to overturn the no call.

GB 

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1 minute ago, GB4 said:

I am assuming on a missed PI that is challenged, it will have to be really egregious to overturn the no call.

GB 

One owner made a great point about this being a slippery slope. This is the first thing that can be reviewed based on no call made on the field.  I know it was a horrible call. I think there are better ways to ensure an official does not make that mistake again.

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20 minutes ago, Irishman said:

One owner made a great point about this being a slippery slope. This is the first thing that can be reviewed based on no call made on the field.  I know it was a horrible call. I think there are better ways to ensure an official does not make that mistake again.

From Albert Breer on Twitter, 

"Sources: The 32 head coaches crafted a proposal to add an official in the booth to oversee "clear and obvious" mistakes on DPI, OPI, roughing the passer, defenseless player rules. The HCs then voted 32-0 to present it.

NFL isn't planning a vote on it. Some coaches aren't happy."

I think this would have been a better solution. 

GB 

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