6A Tournament: OFFICIAL Thread

[temptation]

13 minutes ago, 23andCounting said:

You mean all the hardware at the three largest schools in the state? In all fairness, there are 100 current coaches who could win at Carmel, 90 at Ben Davis, 80 at Warren central, and maybe 40 at Penn. 

Snider and Penn's historical records speak for themselves. Try to discredit them all you want. Penn still has 5 state championships...........not the 11 each the three largest schools have, but still a pretty impressive resume. Snider has 3, could easily be 8 (not including 1981). Could  you imagine if Snider had 3500 plus kids? I'm sure were talking 11+ state titles. That's just common sense. 

Never doubted the state championships, but win totals?  C’mon man…you’re reaching pretty deep for some flexes these days.

Of course you are going to lead the state in wins when you spent how many decades as the only school north of Indy with 2500+ kids and play in a JV conference.

8 minutes ago, 23andCounting said:

You're not going to gain Temp's favor with that one. If only the past 25 years count, that puts Michigan as the 14th winningest program in the NCAA. That being said, I think "past 25 years" are for the Johnny-come-lately's who want to be included in the conversation. 

But #1 in 2023…

[23andCounting]

5 minutes ago, temptation said:

Never doubted the state championships, but win totals?  C’mon man…you’re reaching pretty deep for some flexes these days.

I much prefer "pound for pound" conversations, which pretty much excludes all of Suburban Indy with the exception of New Pal. So there ya go. Indy, arguably, has the best pound for pound program in the state. Of course Adams Central up here in the northeastern part of the state might have something to say about that. 

[temptation]

2 minutes ago, 23andCounting said:

I much prefer "pound for pound" conversations, which pretty much excludes all of Suburban Indy with the exception of New Pal. So there ya go. Indy, arguably, has the best pound for pound program in the state. Of course Adams Central up here in the northeastern part of the state might have something to say about that. 

But those are hypothetical.

They don’t fill trophy cases with fake trophies that are made up on the internet.

[23andCounting]

5 minutes ago, temptation said:

But those are hypothetical.

They don’t fill trophy cases with fake trophies that are made up on the internet.

No, you're right. Big enrollment schools and programs with no boundaries fill up trophy cases. Thump that chest! Thump that chest! Thump that chest!

[temptation]

6 minutes ago, 23andCounting said:

No, you're right. Big enrollment schools and programs with no boundaries fill up trophy cases. Thump that chest! Thump that chest! Thump that chest!

6A ones anyways…are you including Center Grove?

Edited October 24, 2025 by temptation

[23andCounting]

2 minutes ago, temptation said:

6A ones anyways…are you including Center Grove?

I'm impressed with what Eric Moore has done at Center Grove. There are a lot of coaches out there who'd love to have 2900 students like he does, but nonetheless, he's done an impressive job. WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY more impressed with Center Grove than I am Carmel, Warren Central, and Ben Davis. Speaking of Harding, what if they had 3000 kids..........holy s***.

[temptation]

20 minutes ago, 23andCounting said:

I'm impressed with what Eric Moore has done at Center Grove. There are a lot of coaches out there who'd love to have 2900 students like he does, but nonetheless, he's done an impressive job. WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY more impressed with Center Grove than I am Carmel, Warren Central, and Ben Davis. Speaking of Harding, what if they had 3000 kids..........holy s***.

Just now grew to 2900…Eric was winning em well before.

[23andCounting]

8 hours ago, temptation said:

Just now grew to 2900…Eric was winning em well before.

I get that. I wanna say CG was in the range of 2300-2400 when he took over, same size as Homestead. Kudos to him, great coach, great program. It all starts at the top. 

[temptation]

36 minutes ago, 23andCounting said:

I get that. I wanna say CG was in the range of 2300-2400 when he took over, same size as Homestead. Kudos to him, great coach, great program. It all starts at the top. 

Try 1500.

[23andCounting]

2 minutes ago, temptation said:

Try 1500.

Good for him, even better.

[Rodney]

Meanwhile I just pick chatard and their 3 million state championships as the best program

[23andCounting]

21 minutes ago, temptation said:

Try 1500.

They jumped 487 kids from 1999-2000? Wow.

2000 Student Enrollment: 1987 Grade 9 Enrollment: 569 Grade 10 Enrollment: 507 Grade 11 Enrollment: 441 Grade 12 Enrollment: 470 Total White Enrollment: 1965 Total Black Enrollment: 2 Total Hispanic Enrollment: 6 Total Asian Enrollment: 13 Total Indian Enrollment: 1 Grades in Center Grove High School 9th Grade(29%) 11th Grade(22%) 10th Grade(26%) 12th Grade(24%) Races in Center Grove High School White (99%) Other (1%) White ● Value: 98.9
Read more: https://www.city-data.com/school/center-grove-high-school-in.html
 

1 minute ago, Rodney said:

Meanwhile I just pick chatard and their 3 million state championships as the best program

Very deserving, great program.

[temptation]

52 minutes ago, 23andCounting said:

They jumped 487 kids from 1999-2000? Wow.

2000 Student Enrollment: 1987 Grade 9 Enrollment: 569 Grade 10 Enrollment: 507 Grade 11 Enrollment: 441 Grade 12 Enrollment: 470 Total White Enrollment: 1965 Total Black Enrollment: 2 Total Hispanic Enrollment: 6 Total Asian Enrollment: 13 Total Indian Enrollment: 1 Grades in Center Grove High School 9th Grade(29%) 11th Grade(22%) 10th Grade(26%) 12th Grade(24%) Races in Center Grove High School White (99%) Other (1%) White ● Value: 98.9
Read more: https://www.city-data.com/school/center-grove-high-school-in.html
 

Very deserving, great program.

https://ihsaapublic.blob.core.windows.net/archive/b-baseball/Assignments20012003.htm#:~:text=The enrollment numbers listed in,97 schools to Class A.

[23andCounting]

6 minutes ago, temptation said:

https://ihsaapublic.blob.core.windows.net/archive/b-baseball/Assignments20012003.htm#:~:text=The enrollment numbers listed in,97 schools to Class A.

• The enrollment number listed is for male and female students in grades 9, 10 and 11 as submitted to the Indiana Department of Education and the IHSAA in September 2000.

You had me going there for a minute, but I really didn't think CG was that small when he took over. Thought I'd look into it. 

[BLACKGOLD2007]

23 hours ago, PDB26 said:

I’m not saying Westfield should be rewarded with the second seed. I’m saying they are the second best team on the north side of the bracket.

Sure, they have every chance to prove that in the tournament. Teams that win their games Like Carmel and CP should be granted their reward of home games. I am not saying Westfield is bad or less than CP, based on merit of winning their schedule they earned the two spot. 

I punished Penn for their weak schedule but yet still gave them the five seed because they took care of business. Even though every person that lives south of 24 believes that Penn would be a sub .500 team in the HCC most years. Which is likely true, but again, win your schedule and get the rewards of playing home playoff games. 

 

 

[Justasportsfan]

11 hours ago, 23andCounting said:

Speaking of Harding, what if they had 3000 kids..........holy s***.

🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆

[FastpacedO]

On 10/23/2025 at 8:16 AM, 23andCounting said:

Good grief, lots to unpack here. I'll try to keep it brief. 

1.) I gotta laugh at "would lose" to Fishers. I think you meant "could lose." Although I have that game going either way, I still have CP above Fishers in seeding since 2. CP doesn't have two MASSIVE blowout losses on their resume. That's a hill I'll die on, 3.) and if I were on the committee, I'd pull a 72 hour shift defending that one. Like it or not, 4.) Crown Point's has three good looking wins over Merrillville, Pike, and Lowell. That outweighs Fishers massive blowout losses to Brownsburg and Carmel. Just be happy 5.) I'm giving in to Westfield. At some point, winning matters. 

1.) Nope I meant what I stated CP would lose to Fishers. I would take Fishers by 7 points at minimum a 3 point victory. You don't have to like my opinion and can laugh all you want. I stated what I stated. I think Sturgill, Rozzi, and Thembulembu would have a terrific game against the CP Bulldogs. All 3 of them played fantastic against Carmel. They had a rough time in game 1 stopping the Greyhounds offense.

2.) Crown Point has not played ANYONE in the same hemisphere as Carmel, Brownsburg, and even Westfield. That includes Merrillville! So where would they get that massive blowout from? Fishers wouldn't either with Crown Points schedule. Fishers schedule strength sits at #1 right now Crown Point 39, only Penn (123), FW Northrop (82), and Elkahrt (114) in the top 25 of 6A via Sagarin have a weaker schedule and only Penn in the top 10.

3.) Thankfully for all of us you aren't on any committee and won't be wasting 72 hours of your time. Even if there were seeding there wouldn't be a committee that decides on their own. They would likely use a point system similar to Sagarin but also takes into account all opponents and the opponent's record, in which case those numbers wouldn't be far off from Sagarin the seed proposed using Sagarin.

4.) You lost ALL credibility calling a win over Pike a good looking win and stating that it out weighs a loss to Brownsburg and Carmel. Pike (3-6) is not good by any stretch of the imagination this year. Pike's only 3 wins are against Southport (1-8), 3A Guerin Catholic (5-4) and North Central (2-7). Pike lost to HCC bottom feeder Zionsville (3-6, 2-5 in conference play) 27-7. Lowell is having a much improved year in 4A but are in no way shape or form a good comparison to Carmel or Brownsburg, sorry they just aren't. Merrillville while some talented players have never been a real threat I would not put them on same footing as Brownsburg or Carmel. They are to date the best team Crown Point has played I would have them lower than both Lawrence North and HSE (both of whom Fishers beat) and not even in the same stratosphere as Carmel or Brownsburg.

5.) Good for you for recognizing the obvious you have made little bits of strides.

 

[Rodney]

17 minutes ago, FastpacedO said:

 Thembulembu

Can we go off topic for a quick moment to talk about how this is an awesome name

[PDB26]

1 hour ago, BLACKGOLD2007 said:

Sure, they have every chance to prove that in the tournament. Teams that win their games Like Carmel and CP should be granted their reward of home games. I am not saying Westfield is bad or less than CP, based on merit of winning their schedule they earned the two spot. 

I punished Penn for their weak schedule but yet still gave them the five seed because they took care of business. Even though every person that lives south of 24 believes that Penn would be a sub .500 team in the HCC most years. Which is likely true, but again, win your schedule and get the rewards of playing home playoff games. 

 

 

I guess it comes down to how you balance the two teams’ results against their schedules. If the two factors get equal weight, then there is no way you can put CP’s 9-0 ahead of Westfield’s 7-2. If you’re giving more weight to wins and losses, then that seems more appropriate for determining qualifiers for a tournament. 
 

And if anything should be rewarded or punished it should be out of conference scheduling.

[23andCounting]

1 hour ago, FastpacedO said:

1.) Nope I meant what I stated CP would lose to Fishers. I would take Fishers by 7 points at minimum a 3 point victory. You don't have to like my opinion and can laugh all you want. I stated what I stated. I think Sturgill, Rozzi, and Thembulembu would have a terrific game against the CP Bulldogs. All 3 of them played fantastic against Carmel. They had a rough time in game 1 stopping the Greyhounds offense.

2.) Crown Point has not played ANYONE in the same hemisphere as Carmel, Brownsburg, and even Westfield. That includes Merrillville! So where would they get that massive blowout from? Fishers wouldn't either with Crown Points schedule. Fishers schedule strength sits at #1 right now Crown Point 39, only Penn (123), FW Northrop (82), and Elkahrt (114) in the top 25 of 6A via Sagarin have a weaker schedule and only Penn in the top 10.

3.) Thankfully for all of us you aren't on any committee and won't be wasting 72 hours of your time. Even if there were seeding there wouldn't be a committee that decides on their own. They would likely use a point system similar to Sagarin but also takes into account all opponents and the opponent's record, in which case those numbers wouldn't be far off from Sagarin the seed proposed using Sagarin.

4.) You lost ALL credibility calling a win over Pike a good looking win and stating that it out weighs a loss to Brownsburg and Carmel. Pike (3-6) is not good by any stretch of the imagination this year. Pike's only 3 wins are against Southport (1-8), 3A Guerin Catholic (5-4) and North Central (2-7). Pike lost to HCC bottom feeder Zionsville (3-6, 2-5 in conference play) 27-7. Lowell is having a much improved year in 4A but are in no way shape or form a good comparison to Carmel or Brownsburg, sorry they just aren't. Merrillville while some talented players have never been a real threat I would not put them on same footing as Brownsburg or Carmel. They are to date the best team Crown Point has played I would have them lower than both Lawrence North and HSE (both of whom Fishers beat) and not even in the same stratosphere as Carmel or Brownsburg.

5.) Good for you for recognizing the obvious you have made little bits of strides.

 

That's a lot to say to someone who doesn't have any credibility. I do love your passion. Good luck to your team this weekend. 

[FastpacedO]

11 minutes ago, 23andCounting said:

That's a lot to say to someone who doesn't have any credibility. I do love your passion. Good luck to your team this weekend. 

You can say I have no credibility if you want. I do know one thing I certainly am not going to tout Pike (3-6) as a good win. And they certainly are nowhere in the stratosphere of Brownsburg, Carmel, or Westfield. Their last outing was a 42-7 thumping to Lawrence North (who has an outstanding RB and are very athletic)). I just don't know that the LN defense can stop the Brownsburg or Carmel offense). LN probably has the shiftiest, most athletic, and talented RB in the state. Feel free to watch some film on him. I still would take Brownsburg and Carmel over LN. I would probably have LN and Westfield as a toss up and LN slightly above Fishers. I would have LN above CP, CP would score some points against the LN defense but Zay Moore would have a field day with the CP defense.

[23andCounting]

17 minutes ago, FastpacedO said:

You can say I have no credibility if you want. 

When did I say that?

[temptation]

39 minutes ago, 23andCounting said:

When did I say that?

You’ve got all of your chips pushed to the middle of the table on a northern 6A team not named Carmel.

How close do Carroll/Crown Point have to be to the sectional 4 winner in order for you to claim a moral victory?

Or are you going to claim they out hit them and if the game were 5 quarters they would’ve won?

Edited October 24, 2025 by temptation

[23andCounting]

9 minutes ago, temptation said:

You’ve got all of your chips pushed to the middle of the table on a northern 6A team not named Carmel.

How close do Carroll/Crown Point have to be to the sectional 4 winner in order for you to claim a moral victory?

Or are you going to claim they out hit them and if the game were 5 quarters they would’ve won?

Good grief Temp, not sure who's posts you've been reading. When did I say anyone other than Carmel would come out of 6A North?

Why are you asking me about a scenario that's not going to happen?

Five quarters huh? Good Lord. Every team in the state that lost by 8 points or less at some point in the season would ask for a 5th quarter. I don't think that just applies to the teams I root for, does it? Let's get to the game first, in person. Then I'll tell you who hit harder. I've only been to a couple of games this season. Carroll and Warsaw had the loud popping hits that stood out. 

[US31]

1 hour ago, 23andCounting said:

When did I say that?

A few post before…

1 hour ago, 23andCounting said:

That's a lot to say to someone who doesn't have any credibility. I do love your passion. Good luck to your team this weekend. 

I could see that interpreted different ways.  No dog in the fight…just calling balls and strikes

Edited October 24, 2025 by US31