Stoner Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 55 minutes ago, gonzoron said: Those who want a qualification system seem to be forgetting the main focus and purpose of high school sports. Can't like this one enough. It's supposed to be education-based athletics. And whether you get straight A's or straight F's during the year, you still take a final exam. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bash Riprock Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 13 minutes ago, Bobref said: Like most good ideas, different people like and dislike it for different reasons. But it does address the idea, heard often in these pages, that a qualification format would result in teams eliminated from post-season play “giving up” in their remaining games because they “have nothing to play for.” One thing is for sure...like death and taxes, it is a certainty that this topic will be hashed and rehashed on at least an annual basis on this forum.... I will continue to say that this is bigger than football with the IHSAA. Bottom line, there is zero driver to take a game away from kids, expect for the appeal to a segment of the fan base. And I don't see that being a big enough reason to change. Compound the issue with the past qualifier system in this state being not being considered as a success....far from it. Seeding...that has a much higher probability in my opinion. But hey, lets debate it each and every year.....quite the exercise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballking16 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 1 hour ago, Stoner said: Can't like this one enough. It's supposed to be education-based athletics. And whether you get straight A's or straight F's during the year, you still take a final exam. Why does every other state, sans 1 or 2 others, have a qualification format? Where does the entitlement to playing a “tenth” game come into play? High school football is a privilege not a right, why shouldn’t a postseason birth be earned? 4 hours ago, Bullhorn99 said: Footballking16 in multiple posts referred to the regular season as meaningless--that is the exact wording--the posts did not say "less meaningful". Meaningless in the sense that regular season game outcomes have zero direct effect on the postseason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballking16 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 15 hours ago, Komets2727 said: Show me one place where I said the regular season has a major connotation. The regular season means jack crap!!! Ask any player, would they rather have a great regular season and do nothing in the playoffs or vice versa. I promise you it is all about the playoffs. Doesn’t matter the sport, you will get the same response. Nobody remembers who won a conference title, but they do remember a sectional title, every school, every time. Regional title, semi-state title, and state title the legend just grows with each step. I remember my high school career well, many years ago, but my memory is better when it comes to playoff time and with each title they I was a part of. Would the regular season mean jack crap if you had to actually qualify for the postseason?? You’re literally making my point. The regular season means jack crap because it has zero bearing on the postseason. Make teams qualify for the postseason and regular season games now take on real, actual value. Its not that hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tippy Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 41 minutes ago, Footballking16 said: Would the regular season mean jack crap if you had to actually qualify for the postseason?? You’re literally making my point. The regular season means jack crap because it has zero bearing on the postseason. Make teams qualify for the postseason and regular season games now take on real, actual value. Its not that hard. Everybody in Indiana knew all of this in 1985 and most people still wanted all the teams in the playoffs. In 1985 people said you now have two seasons and everybody gets to start over at 0-0. Were you out there with a sign in 1985 saying don't do this? Everything that has been said on here was said in 1985. I hope you haven't been trying to get this changed for the past 37 years. Its just like basketball, every team gets to start over at the end of the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobref Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 1 hour ago, Bash Riprock said: take a game away from kids Interesting how this sort of statement is repeated often, yet simple math shows it is false. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bash Riprock Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 47 minutes ago, Bobref said: Interesting how this sort of statement is repeated often, yet simple math shows it is false. LOL....always go to your local legal team for mathematics support....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bash Riprock Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 2 hours ago, Footballking16 said: Why does every other state, sans 1 or 2 others, have a qualification format? Where does the entitlement to playing a “tenth” game come into play? High school football is a privilege not a right, why shouldn’t a postseason birth be earned? Meaningless in the sense that regular season game outcomes have zero direct effect on the postseason. Maybe I missed it...so if we cut 6A from 32 to 16 teams per your proposal to qualify for post season play....how does this help the kids? (both players and the student body) Coaching staffs? I understand it makes it more exciting for you. Honest question.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHJIrish Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 On 10/11/2022 at 3:06 PM, Footballking16 said: Then why play the regular season? Practice, scrimmage, jamboree and most importantly because we love football and there's revenue too. It doesn't hurt anyone to play an all-in, and it's never been my idea to conform because others do it. Just let everyone play! It gets weeded out soon enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobref Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 1 hour ago, Bash Riprock said: Maybe I missed it. That’s the first correct thing you’ve said so far. 😂🤣 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullhorn99 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 3 hours ago, Footballking16 said: Meaningless in the sense that regular season game outcomes have zero direct effect on the postseason. I guess I would say "So what!"? Why does there need to be a connection between the tournament and the regular season? If someone is unable to see the value and impact that involvement in a regular season of football provides for players, schools, communities, etc. I just don't know what to say. I'm actually intrigued by the concept of a qualifying tournament; I just have yet to hear a practical argument that I could get behind. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHJIrish Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 7 minutes ago, Bullhorn99 said: I guess I would say "So what!"? Why does there need to be a connection between the tournament and the regular season? If someone is unable to see the value and impact that involvement in a regular season of football provides for players, schools, communities, etc. I just don't know what to say. I'm actually intrigued by the concept of a qualifying tournament; I just have yet to hear a practical argument that I could get behind. I agree with all you say! I also have not heard a good reason, except other states do it. More football is always good for this old fan! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Komets2727 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 4 hours ago, Footballking16 said: Would the regular season mean jack crap if you had to actually qualify for the postseason?? You’re literally making my point. The regular season means jack crap because it has zero bearing on the postseason. Make teams qualify for the postseason and regular season games now take on real, actual value. Its not that hard. Everyone prepares for the postseason, especially coaches. Every coach wants to peak in the postseason, not game 4. It really is not that hard to understand… Even coaches have commented in this thread to point out how wrong you are, yet it means nothing to you. Whatever dude, let it go and live in your fantasy world… 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoner Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 6 hours ago, Footballking16 said: Why does every other state, sans 1 or 2 others, have a qualification format? Where does the entitlement to playing a “tenth” game come into play? High school football is a privilege not a right, why shouldn’t a postseason birth be earned? I really wouldn't know--you'd have to individually ask the other state's associations. But if I was guessing, I would imagine that there are some who have toyed with the notion of an all-inclusive tournament, but the logistics plus the time constraint of the sport seasons make it non-feasible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobref Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 3 hours ago, Stoner said: I really wouldn't know--you'd have to individually ask the other state's associations. But if I was guessing, I would imagine that there are some who have toyed with the notion of an all-inclusive tournament, but the logistics plus the time constraint of the sport seasons make it non-feasible. Yeah, that’s the reason there hasn’t been a rush by other states to follow the Indiana example … in the last 37 yrs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoner Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 1 hour ago, Bobref said: Yeah, that’s the reason there hasn’t been a rush by other states to follow the Indiana example … in the last 37 yrs. https://www.record-eagle.com/sports/mhsaa-might-let-all-football-teams-into-playoffs/article_2609f56e-2798-11ec-ad9b-43ee49087bdc.html 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHJIrish Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 12 hours ago, Bobref said: Yeah, that’s the reason there hasn’t been a rush by other states to follow the Indiana example … in the last 37 yrs. Why don't you just save it for next year, Bob? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobref Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 1 minute ago, PHJIrish said: Why don't you just save it for next year, Bob? Because the naysayers will have the same response next year, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHJIrish Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 43 minutes ago, Bobref said: Because the naysayers will have the same response next year, too. Yep! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Komets2727 Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 13 hours ago, Bobref said: Yeah, that’s the reason there hasn’t been a rush by other states to follow the Indiana example … in the last 37 yrs. What you fail to point out is that EVERY sport in Indiana qualifies for the playoffs, volleyball, basketball, football, softball, cross country, tennis, etc… Yet, you want football to be different because that is what you want… Makes perfect sense…😂 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestfieldRocks Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 On 10/10/2022 at 11:37 AM, vicvinegar said: 3 thoughts about programs qualifying: 1) A lot of teams would do their best to avoid any competition during the regular season. Who would want to play "independent" teams like Cathedral, Center Grove or Carmel? MIC and HCC schools already have a difficult schedule. On top of that, how many teams would want to bail their conference? 2) Programs would have to pick between money and increasing their odds to make the playoffs. If I'm Columbus North, I can schedule Perry Meridian or Cathedral. One gives me better odds to make the playoffs, but it cost our school money. This also goes for struggling programs that actually need the money. 3) What happens to teams like Zionsville the past two years? I assume 4 win teams won't make the cut. Keep everything the way it is. Water will find it's level one way or another. The last thing needed is something like the old Cluster System to determine playoff teams. That was more of a cluster **** 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHJIrish Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 Instead of a play in playoff yearly discussion, why not lobby for an automatic first down for personal foul penalties, inside the 30 yard line, half the distance penalties. Now there's something that's really needed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazed and confused Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 Im just asking so wood a qualifying playoff system cause teams that could, run up the score like crazy in the regular season to gain any advantage they could to make the playoffs ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxbat Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 1 hour ago, dazed and confused said: Im just asking so wood a qualifying playoff system cause teams that could, run up the score like crazy in the regular season to gain any advantage they could to make the playoffs ? Not if you used something akin to the Elo rating which looks at wins/losses and pretty much ignores margins/scores. Sagain used to include this on his Indiana high school football site, but seems to have removed it. You could blunt the impact of run-ups, although not necessarily the propensity for them to happen, using Sagarin's "Predictor" stat, since once you get to a certain margin, more doesn't matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bash Riprock Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 On 10/14/2022 at 11:48 PM, Bobref said: Yeah, that’s the reason there hasn’t been a rush by other states to follow the Indiana example … in the last 37 yrs. Pretty sure Maryland went all in during Covid year and is now considering making it permanent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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