CFP Championship

[temptation]

14 minutes ago, Bobref said:

Just throwing one out there to see who would bite. You never disappoint. 😂🤣😅

I always bite on dumb takes.

Edited January 10 by temptation

[temptation]

6 minutes ago, Coach Nowlin said:

There are 3 programs and then everyone else, doesn't matter if you expand to 12 teams, its Georgia, Bama, OSU..............then next tier, the gap from top tier to next is unbelievably large 

Proof of my claim above...

Michigan has defeated Ohio State by a combined score of 87-50 over the past two seasons and finished #3 in the AP poll two consecutive years...and returns tons from this year's squad in 2023-24.

Now, if you want to talk recruiting...those three are heads and shoulders above in most years.

 

Is it feasible that once we expand to 12, we could have an all-SEC final four more often than not depending upon how the seeds play out?

[WolvesOnTheProwl]

@temptation seems like the yearly talk But do you expect Jim Harbaugh back next season?

[temptation]

1 minute ago, WolvesOnTheProwl said:

@temptation seems like the yearly talk But do you expect Jim Harbaugh back next season?

I don't even know anymore.  I know that he said last year was the end of it but the changing landscape of the college game really seems to be getting to him.  The current NCAA "sanctions" are a joke compared to what is going on in other parts of the country.

I am kind of indifferent at this point.  Just want to get it over with and move on.  His waffling hurts recruiting.

[Coach Nowlin]

doesn't mean that in 1 game series, those teams could have an off night and lose, but if anyone thought that last nights game was going to be competitive was clearly just biased against another SEC team winning national championship

[temptation]

10 minutes ago, Coach Nowlin said:

doesn't mean that in 1 game series, those teams could have an off night and lose, but if anyone thought that last nights game was going to be competitive was clearly just biased against another SEC team winning national championship

So OSU had "off nights" on two consecutive Thanksgiving weekends and lost by an average of 18.5 points?

Michigan has rightfully earned the right to be in your "tier 1" (although right now I am not sure anyone other than Georgia is in tier 1).

Edited January 10 by temptation

[Bash Riprock]

53 minutes ago, temptation said:

Proof of my claim above...

Michigan has defeated Ohio State by a combined score of 87-50 over the past two seasons and finished #3 in the AP poll two consecutive years...and returns tons from this year's squad in 2023-24.

Now, if you want to talk recruiting...those three are heads and shoulders above in most years.

 

Is it feasible that once we expand to 12, we could have an all-SEC final four more often than not depending upon how the seeds play out?

Proof of what?  Bottom line, Michigan lost in the CFP to a team that was demolished last night in the championship game.  In doing so, they were outrushed by 90 yds by TCU.  The same TCU team that couldn't run the ball at all against UGA. 

Glad you can hang your hat on Michigan beating Ohio State the last 2 years...because that's all you got.

[temptation]

9 minutes ago, Bash Riprock said:

Proof of what?  Bottom line, Michigan lost in the CFP to a team that was demolished last night in the championship game.  In doing so, they were outrushed by 90 yds by TCU.  The same TCU team that couldn't run the ball at all against UGA. 

Glad you can hang your hat on Michigan beating Ohio State the last 2 years...because that's all you got.

Proof of an idiotic take that UGA, Bama and OSU's gap on everyone else is "unbelievably large."

Two consecutive conference titles/playoff appearances is "all I've got"...damn.

You really let your hatred of me cloud your judgment.

 

[Bobref]

1 hour ago, temptation said:

So OSU had "off nights" on two consecutive Thanksgiving weekends and lost by an average of 18.5 points?

Michigan has rightfully earned the right to be in your "tier 1" (although right now I am not sure anyone other than Georgia is in tier 1).

Do you think Michigan is chronically underrated, at least in part, because their coach is widely regarded as, at best, an oddball and, at worst, a nut bag?

[temptation]

3 minutes ago, Bobref said:

Do you think Michigan is chronically underrated, at least in part, because their coach is widely regarded as, at best, an oddball and, at worst, a nut bag?

Chronically underrated?  No.  Never claimed that.

He is an oddball.  But an oddball that wins...at both levels.  You'd take him right now, don't lie.

One of a handful who actually has proven success at both the college and pro level.

(Also, not going to debate coaching characteristics with someone whose favorite program was led by BRIAN KELLY for years....nut bag doesn't do him justice.)

Edited January 10 by temptation

[Muda69]

3 minutes ago, Bobref said:

Do you think Michigan is chronically underrated, at least in part, because their coach is widely regarded as, at best, an oddball and, at worst, a nut bag?

Links please.

 

[scarab527]

Prepared for the hate that's coming, but if Harrison Jr. isn't taken out by Georgia, OSU wins the Natty. 

[BTF]

12 hours ago, Bobref said:

I can’t help but wonder. Where are the people who were ripping Notre Dame for getting taken to the woodshed in the championship game by Alabama? “They don’t belong.” I don’t hear people saying that about cute little, feel-good story, TCU. I’ve also heard lots of comments about how small their student body is, compared to their opponents’. TCU has a little over 10,000 undergrads and a little under 2,000 grad students. Notre Dame has 9,000 undergrads and 2,200 grad students.   But we never get to be David. We’re always Goliath.

 

[BTF]

Michigan got waxed by Georgia last year. This year Georgia beat the team that beat Michigan 65-7. Claims that Michigan is a Tier 1 program and Notre Dame is not just doesn't add up. 

I like Michigan, but their performance in the playoffs is no better than than Notre Dame. The Irish played the likes of Alabama and Clemson while Michigan played TCU. Huge difference. 

Michigan beat Ohio State two years in a row. I get that. It's a rivalry game, all bets are off. LSU beat Alabama, but that doesn't make them a Tier 1 program. Hell, I wouldn't even have put Ohio State in Tier 1 (never have actually), until they lost to Georgia in a game they should have won. Couple that with a semi-recent national championship and I'll finally give the Buckeyes the benefit of the doubt. 

Here's a question. Is there any guarantee that Michigan would have beaten Notre Dame, LSU, or Alabama this year? It really depends on which Irish team showed up. The team that wasted South Carolina, North Carolina, and Clemson would be a handful for the Wolverines. I've got Michigan slightly over LSU and slightly under Alabama. 

Again, I like our neighbors up north. I like all Big Ten teams. This is an unbiased opinion. 

[temptation]

1 hour ago, scarab527 said:

Prepared for the hate that's coming, but if Harrison Jr. isn't taken out by Georgia, OSU wins the Natty. 

True.

[temptation]

22 minutes ago, BTF said:

Michigan got waxed by Georgia last year. This year Georgia beat the team that beat Michigan 65-7. Claims that Michigan is a Tier 1 program and Notre Dame is not just doesn't add up. 

I like Michigan, but their performance in the playoffs is no better than than Notre Dame. The Irish played the likes of Alabama and Clemson while Michigan played TCU. Huge difference. 

Michigan beat Ohio State two years in a row. I get that. It's a rivalry game, all bets are off. LSU beat Alabama, but that doesn't make them a Tier 1 program. Hell, I wouldn't even have put Ohio State in Tier 1 (never have actually), until they lost to Georgia in a game they should have won. Couple that with a semi-recent national championship and I'll finally give the Buckeyes the benefit of the doubt. 

Here's a question. Is there any guarantee that Michigan would have beaten Notre Dame, LSU, or Alabama this year? It really depends on which Irish team showed up. The team that wasted South Carolina, North Carolina, and Clemson would be a handful for the Wolverines. I've got Michigan slightly over LSU and slightly under Alabama. 

Again, I like our neighbors up north. I like all Big Ten teams. This is an unbiased opinion. 

Just stop.  Michigan picked the wrong night to play it’s worst game of the year gifted TCU 13 points and crapped the bed inside the two yard line twice.

TCU then played its worst game of the year last night (UGA had a lot to do with it just like TCU did 10 days ago against Michigan).  You can’t look at final scores.

So UGA beats TCU by 58 and OSU by 1. TCU beats Michigan by 6 who beat OSU by 22.  It will never make perfect sense. It’s a matchup based sport, not played in a vacuum.

Georgia is in tier 1 alone at this point.  There is no debating that.

There is a substantial gap after the Bulldogs which was proven last night.  Yes, OSU had them on the ropes but Georgia deserves the benefit of the doubt based on the last two years.

I don’t even know where to begin with your Notre Dame statement.  Teams that lose to non-bowl eligible teams (Stanford) and non power 5 teams (Marshall) AT HOME aren’t anywhere near the top tier.  Plus, you are attempting to compete Brian Kelly’s ND teams to the current ND team.  

Freeman/Harbaugh is a no contest at this point/stage.  Kelly was a formidable opponent.

ND will get a chance to redeem itself in 2023 and should win 9 games minimum.  That’s still not good enough to put them up there with the big boys.

Michigan’s schedule is setting up for another 11-12 win season and a shot at redemption.

Will be fun to see it all play out.

Edited January 10 by temptation

[BTF]

30 minutes ago, temptation said:

Just stop.  Michigan picked the wrong night to play it’s worst game of the year gifted TCU 13 points and crapped the bed inside the two yard line twice.

TCU then played its worst game of the year last night (UGA had a lot to do with it just like TCU did 10 days ago against Michigan).  You can’t look at final scores.

So UGA beats TCU by 58 and OSU by 1. TCU beats Michigan by 6 who beat OSU by 22.  It will never make perfect sense. It’s a matchup based sport, not played in a vacuum.

Georgia is in tier 1 alone at this point.  There is no debating that.

There is a substantial gap after the Bulldogs which was proven last night.  Yes, OSU had them on the ropes but Georgia deserves the benefit of the doubt based on the last two years.

I don’t even know where to begin with your Notre Dame statement.  Teams that lose to non-bowl eligible teams (Stanford) and non power 5 teams (Marshall) AT HOME aren’t anywhere near the top tier.  Plus, you are attempting to compete Brian Kelly’s ND teams to the current ND team.  

Freeman/Harbaugh is a no contest at this point/stage.  Kelly was a formidable opponent.

ND will get a chance to redeem itself in 2023 and should win 9 games minimum.  That’s still not good enough to put them up there with the big boys.

Michigan’s schedule is setting up for another 11-12 win season and a shot at redemption.

Will be fun to see it all play out.

Just stop? Why? It's my opinion. I wouldn't exactly say I'm off base or anything. And again, I said it depends on which ND team shows up. The team that lost to Stanford and Marshal would lose to Michigan by 28. The other team will give the Wolverines a run for their money. Michigan earned their ranking this year, no doubt. They also should have been playing Ohio State for the national championship. Georgia never should have never had the opportunity to beat TCU by 58. But they did, and that is what will be remembered. 

Notre Dames chances of going undefeated next year are better than them losing three games. Take it to the bank. Copy and paste this please. The QB transfer is the difference between going to the playoffs and losing the three games you speak of. 

And stating that ND made it's own bed by playing the schedule they did when they went to the playoffs is unfair. They were the most deserving team each of those years to take the 3 or 4 spot. Again, over the past decade, the difference between the top two teams and the rest of the field has been pretty large.

ND doesn't schedule a weak schedule on purpose. It's not their fault USC and Stanford fell apart. Adding Ohio State, Texas A&M, Florida State (they'll be back), Wisconsin, Alabama, and Michigan to the already scheduled Clemson and USC tells me that the Irish have a "come one, come all" approach. 

[temptation]

11 minutes ago, BTF said:

Just stop? Why? It's my opinion. I wouldn't exactly say I'm off base or anything. And again, I said it depends on which ND team shows up. The team that lost to Stanford and Marshal would lose to Michigan by 28. The other team will give the Wolverines a run for their money. Michigan earned their ranking this year, no doubt. They also should have been playing Ohio State for the national championship. Georgia never should have never had the opportunity to beat TCU by 58. But they did, and that is what will be remembered. 

Notre Dames chances of going undefeated next year are better than them losing three games. Take it to the bank. Copy and paste this please. The QB transfer is the difference between going to the playoffs and losing the three games you speak of. 

And stating that ND made it's own bed by playing the schedule they did when they went to the playoffs is unfair. They were the most deserving team each of those years to take the 3 or 4 spot. Again, over the past decade, the difference between the top two teams and the rest of the field has been pretty large.

ND doesn't schedule a weak schedule on purpose. It's not their fault USC and Stanford fell apart. Adding Ohio State, Texas A&M, Florida State (they'll be back), Wisconsin, Alabama, and Michigan to the already scheduled Clemson and USC tells me that the Irish have a "come one, come all" approach. 

And if Michigan is playing at their best?

Week 1 vs Week 13 but using OSU as a common opponent sure doesn’t bode well for the Irish.  Had 9 months to prepare for the Buckeyes and could only manage 10 points?

You said yourself that crazy things happen in rivalry games.  Translation:  Upsets happen and tight games are expected.  Michigan dog walked the Buckeyes by 3+ scores.

Not to mention, Michigan DESTROYED what turned out to be a pretty damn good Penn State team.

Rest of the Big Ten was weak, I get that but the Irish lost 4 games and let powerhouses Cal, Navy and BYU hang around while dominating a vastly overrated Clemson team.

If Michigan and ND play their game and both are on, Michigan is two scores better in 2023.  This is not debatable.  

Edited January 11 by temptation

[BTF]

1 minute ago, temptation said:

And if Michigan is playing at their best?

Week 1 vs Week 13 but using OSU as a common opponent sure doesn’t bode well for the Irish.  Had 9 months to prepare for the Buckeyes and could only manage 10 points?

You said yourself that crazy things happen in rivalry games.  Translation:  Upsets happen and tight games are expected.  Michigan dog walked the Buckeyes by 3+ scores.

Not to mention, Michigan DESTROYED what turned out to be a pretty damn good Penn State team.

Rest of the Big Ten was weak, I get that but the Irish lost 4 games and let powerhouses Cal and BYU hang around while dominating a vastly overrated Clemson team.

If Michigan and ND play their game and both are on, Michigan is two scores better in 2023.  This is not debatable.  

If Michigan and Notre Dame are playing their absolute best on a neutral field............well, I'd probably take Michigan by 7. I wouldn't personally spend too much time debating you on the 14. I could see it happening. No one ever said ND is better than Michigan this year. We're just stating that the body of work by both programs over the last five years put them both in the same Tier 2. 

Michigan "dog walked" Ohio State? Wasn't that game close for three quarters?

Again, Michigan earned their ranking this year and should have been playing the Buckeyes in a rematch. The best teams don't always play in the championship. It happens at the high school level too. 

 

[BTF]

I think the real debate here is what qualifies a team as a Tier 1 program. I always go back 5 years, which puts Notre Dame and Michigan in the same boat. If we're going by present year only, then Michigan gets Tier 1 status. It would have been interesting to see how Michigan would have matched up against Georgia. Sports can be cruel. 

[temptation]

26 minutes ago, BTF said:

If Michigan and Notre Dame are playing their absolute best on a neutral field............well, I'd probably take Michigan by 7. I wouldn't personally spend too much time debating you on the 14. I could see it happening. No one ever said ND is better than Michigan this year. We're just stating that the body of work by both programs over the last five years put them both in the same Tier 2. 

Michigan "dog walked" Ohio State? Wasn't that game close for three quarters?

Again, Michigan earned their ranking this year and should have been playing the Buckeyes in a rematch. The best teams don't always play in the championship. It happens at the high school level too. 

 

Five years?  What in the hell are we talking about here?  When did that enter the equation?  You have to re-evaluate every 2-3 max in my opinion as you can’t continue to live off past glory.  TWO in this case as 2020 was an absolute sham and should be thrown out (ask Michigan/Indiana fans).

That being said, Michigan has entered Ohio State and Alabama territory firmly behind UGA but deserving of being in front of tier 3.  Now they need to prove they are not a flash in the pan like Clemson was.

Clemson was clearly in tier 1 but it’s apparent to all after these last two campaigns that that was due to Watson/Lawrence.  Their last two seasons have been extremely underwhelming.  The loss of Elliott and Venables cannot be overstated.

Since when does “close for three quarters” matter?  It’s not like UM ran up the score and padded stats by throwing the ball up late.  They leaned on the Buckeyes for three quarters, wore them down and then the dam broke.  45-23 (should have been 52 as the Stroud “ forward progress stopped play” would have been an easy scoop and score) is a beat down in every sense of the word.

As I said above, I believe you have to evaluate Marcus Freeman’s ND going forward independent of Brian Kelly’s.  Freeman stopped the bleeding after a horrific start but a couple more single digit win seasons spells trouble in South Bend.
 

[temptation]

29 minutes ago, BTF said:

I think the real debate here is what qualifies a team as a Tier 1 program. I always go back 5 years, which puts Notre Dame and Michigan in the same boat. If we're going by present year only, then Michigan gets Tier 1 status. It would have been interesting to see how Michigan would have matched up against Georgia. Sports can be cruel. 

Georgia by two scores.  They are an exact replica of Michigan just bigger, stronger and faster.  OSU (though not as complete a “team” as Michigan) is a much tougher matchup for UGA due to their speed and skill position talent.

Just wish Michigan would have run the QB earlier against TCU.  They waited too long to unleash JJ.

Stetson burned TCU on the edges from the coin flip last night whereas Michigan chose to keep running into the teeth of the defense until it was too late.

Edited January 11 by temptation

[BTF]

7 minutes ago, temptation said:

Georgia by two scores.  They are an exact replica of Michigan just bigger, stronger and faster.  OSU (though not as complete a “team” as Michigan) is a much tougher matchup for UGA due to their speed and skill position talent.

Just wish Michigan would have run the QB earlier against TCU.  They waited too long to unleash JJ.

Stetson burned TCU on the edges from the coin flip last night whereas Michigan chose to keep running into the teeth of the defense until it was too late.

How does the saying go? You can wish in one hand, shit in the other and see which happens first? Again, sports can be cruel. I wanted an all Big Ten final as much as anyone. 

Why does being close for three quarters matter? It means that two equal caliber teams were engaged in a competitive battle. Michigan has a couple of big plays early in the fourth and you get a snowball affect. Michigan beats TCU nine times out of ten. Ohio State plays Michigan within a touchdown nine times out of ten. 

[gonzoron]

Surprised no one has mentioned this, could hasten the departure to the Pros?:

https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/michigan-jim-harbaugh-under-ncaa-investigation-for-alleged-recruiting-practice-violations/

[Bash Riprock]

9 hours ago, temptation said:

Proof of an idiotic take that UGA, Bama and OSU's gap on everyone else is "unbelievably large."

Two consecutive conference titles/playoff appearances is "all I've got"...damn.

You really let your hatred of me cloud your judgment.

 

 

Not putting Michigan to the level of UGA, Bama and OSU has nothing to do with you. Thinking it does…not sure to laugh or feel a tad sorry for ya. Would not invest the energy in you to hate. 
 

Michigan was out rushed by TCU…by 90 yds. They couldn’t stop TCU’s rushing at the end of their game, resulting in all of their timeouts being burnt and valuable time off the clock wasted. They were behind the entire game and put the ball in the hands of a mediocre QB that made repeated mistakes. TCU beat them. TCU was destroyed by UGA. TCU couldn’t move the ball against the Dawgs. Michigan is not in UGA’s league. At least not this year. Sorry that upsets you. But that is fact based on performance in the playoffs. 
 

Michigan is in the tier directly below UGA, Bama and perhaps  OSU. No shame in that. 

49 minutes ago, gonzoron said:

Surprised no one has mentioned this, could hasten the departure to the Pros?:

https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/michigan-jim-harbaugh-under-ncaa-investigation-for-alleged-recruiting-practice-violations/

Perhaps following the path of Pete Carroll??