The Coronavirus - a virus from eating bats, an accident or something sinister gone wrong?

[Howe]

14 hours ago, Bobref said:

The drug ranitidine does not cause cancer. Small amounts of NDMA, an impurity, was found, and testing determined that, as the medication ages in storage, the amount of NDMA can increase, depending on the conditions under which it is stored. NDMA is a probable human carcinogen ... in high doses. Hence, the recall. This was a flaw in the manufacturing process, not in the evaluation of the drug.

Interesting. Unless the manufacturing process has changed from the original manufacturing process approved by the FDA, apparently the excessively high levels of NDMA have always been present in ranitidine.

[DanteEstonia]

13 minutes ago, Howe said:

Interesting. Unless the manufacturing process has changed from the original manufacturing process approved by the FDA, apparently the excessively high levels of NDMA have always been present in ranitidine.

Probably a bit of both. Axiron was on the market before the yoga pants thing was known.

[Howe]

I just returned from grocery shopping and each week since the government shutdown Kroger and Wal Mart are absolutely packed with customers. These large corporations have ran all of the small independent grocery stores out of business years ago. Kroger and Wal Mart are the only options in my neighborhood of Indianapolis.

It is ridiculous to have all of these businesses shut down to enforce "social distancing" and curb the spread of the virus only to have everyone congregate at the grocery store at least once a week. Eighty percent of the customers are not wearing masks and no one is maintaining social distancing. The Kroger and Wal Mart in my neighborhood are super centers and massive with hundreds of customers at all times.

[Irishman]

1 hour ago, Howe said:

I just returned from grocery shopping and each week since the government shutdown Kroger and Wal Mart are absolutely packed with customers. These large corporations have ran all of the small independent grocery stores out of business years ago. Kroger and Wal Mart are the only options in my neighborhood of Indianapolis.

It is ridiculous to have all of these businesses shut down to enforce "social distancing" and curb the spread of the virus only to have everyone congregate at the grocery store at least once a week. Eighty percent of the customers are not wearing masks and no one is maintaining social distancing. The Kroger and Wal Mart in my neighborhood are super centers and massive with hundreds of customers at all times.

It is a shame that smaller, locally owned places have been run out, not just in grocery stores, but think hardware, furniture, pet stores. Thankfully, restaurants still provide plenty of local options. As far as Kroger goes, I will say it is so worth it to me to pay an extra $9.95 to have them delivered, to simply avoid the chaos. 

[DanteEstonia]

1 hour ago, Irishman said:

It is a shame that smaller, locally owned places have been run out, not just in grocery stores, but think hardware, furniture, pet stores. Thankfully, restaurants still provide plenty of local options. As far as Kroger goes, I will say it is so worth it to me to pay an extra $9.95 to have them delivered, to simply avoid the chaos. 

Kroger is also Union, which is why they’ve earned my money over the years.

Kroger is called Smith’s in Vegas.

Edited April 26, 2020 by DanteEstonia

[gonzoron]

[Muda69]

The Frankfort, Indiana Frito-Lay facility, the 2nd largest facility PepsiCo owns in the U.S.,   shut down yesterday evening for at least the next 24 hours for "deep cleaning".  Supposedly several of their employees have tested positive recently.

Also I have heard that the Subaru plant in Lafayette has recalled all of it's hourly and salaried maintenance workers, beginning today,  for preparation of restarting vehicle production in a couple of weeks.

Also Cass county, while being primarily rural,  looks to be a growing hot spot for Covid-19 with 315 cases:  https://bao.arcgis.com/covid-19/jhu/county/18017.html 

 

[Bobref]

1 hour ago, Muda69 said:

Also Cass county, while being primarily rural,  looks to be a growing hot spot for Covid-19 with 315 cases:  https://bao.arcgis.com/covid-19/jhu/county/18017.html 

The disproportionately high number of cases in Cass County appears to be attributable to an outbreak at the Tyson’s pork processing plant there. 
https://www.pharostribune.com/news/local_news/article_c30ada0e-841f-11ea-833e-2394c5e1bbbe.html   Still, only 1 death.

Edited April 27, 2020 by Bobref

[swordfish]

On 4/24/2020 at 9:21 AM, gonzoron said:

We'll never know. Ingesting disinfectants is the latest recommendation.

SF personally doesn't see a problem if a few Tide-Pod munchers are stupid enough to think the President "recommended" drinking some Lysol.  (which he didn't) but still - thinning the herd of a few of the idiots isn't a bad thing.....(IMHO)

 

On 4/24/2020 at 3:52 PM, gonzoron said:

Anecdotal, whether it's one or ten that you've found. Where is your link to a clinical study?

I pity your doctor.....Especially if you ask to review the clinical studies for any drug he/she prescribes for you.....

 

SF heard a new term this morning...."Clinical Covid".....One who displays Covid 19 symptoms but tests negative.......Yet counts as a confirmed Covid 19 patient for the state numbers.......

Also heard on CBS this morning the number of people testing as having the antibodies that indicate having already had the virus is as high as 80 times the confirmed cases in some states......which would indicate this virus isn't as much of a killer as first thought........

[gonzoron]

1 minute ago, swordfish said:

I pity your doctor.....Especially if you ask to review the clinical studies for any drug he/she prescribes for you..

I don't have one. Your pity is misplaced. If no one besides me questions the effectiveness of the drugs that are prescribed to them, I pity those people.

[swordfish]

1 minute ago, gonzoron said:

I don't have one. Your pity is misplaced. If no one besides me questions the effectiveness of the drugs that are prescribed to them, I pity those people.

I have nothing else to say  (unless you're an MD, then please accept my apologies.....but I have a suspicion your not...)😁

[Howe]

17 minutes ago, swordfish said:

SF heard a new term this morning...."Clinical Covid".....One who displays Covid 19 symptoms but tests negative.......Yet counts as a confirmed Covid 19 patient for the state numbers.......

Also heard on CBS this morning the number of people testing as having the antibodies that indicate having already had the virus is as high as 80 times the confirmed cases in some states......which would indicate this virus isn't as much of a killer as first thought........

Trump was correct when he stated "The democrats are politicizing the coronavirus. That is their new hoax". Democrats do not care about working class people. Sowing panic is their only chance to win power in November.

[Howe]

On 4/12/2020 at 2:55 PM, Howe said:

His contribution to this forum is serial abuse the "disdain"  feature to the point where one or more moderator(s) awarded Muda with 20,000 positive points. 

This is not normal behavior for a grown man.

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[swordfish]

[Muda69]

1 hour ago, Bobref said:

The disproportionately high number of cases in Cass County appears to be attributable to an outbreak at the Tyson’s pork processing plant there. 
https://www.pharostribune.com/news/local_news/article_c30ada0e-841f-11ea-833e-2394c5e1bbbe.html   Still, only 1 death.

That is one thing I notice about these "quick stats" I see online.   They list the number infected, the number of deaths, but not the number who have successfully recovered after showing symptoms.  Why is that I wonder?

 

[Muda69]

Social Security Will Be Insolvent Even Sooner Than Expected, Thanks to COVID-19 Pandemic

https://reason.com/2020/04/24/social-security-will-be-insolvent-even-sooner-thanks-to-covid-19-pandemic/

Quote

The trustees of the Social Security Administration released their annual report on the program's long-term solvency on Wednesday—but the report is likely already out of date since it doesn't take into account the sharp economic downturn triggered by the COVID-19 pandemic.

Even without the pandemic factoring into the calculations, Social Security is heading for insolvency by 2035, the report says. That doesn't mean the program will be bankrupt, but it represents the date when Social Security's reserves would be used up and mandatory benefit cuts would be instituted across the board. If nothing is done to shore up Social Security, current projections anticipate that beneficiaries will receive only 79 percent of expected benefits, with further cuts needed in future years.

Fifteen years might seem like a long time, but it's really not. Anyone over age 50 today is likely facing the prospect of benefit cuts happening before they retire.

And, again, that doesn't account for the current economic crisis.

If the coronavirus results in economic losses of 15 percent for the current year, the program would likely face insolvency by 2034, says Stephen Goss, chief actuary for the Social Security Administration. Another year of losses would move that date even closer.

"We just don't know if we're going to be back to normal this year, next year, or when," Goss said Thursday during an event hosted by the Bipartisan Policy Center, a centrist think tank.

And if the coronavirus response triggers a long-term recession, the urgency of Social Security's status becomes more apparent. According to a projection from the Bipartisan Policy Institute, another recession of the length and depth of the so-called Great Recession that followed the 2008 market crash would cause Social Security to face insolvency before the end of the current decade.

 

Source: Bipartisan Policy Center Source: https://bipartisanpolicy.org/blog/covid-19-may-deplete-social-security-trust-funds-this-decade/

"This is a concerning report, even before the virus crisis hit," says Charles Blahous, senior research strategist for the free market Mercatus Center and a former trustee for Social Security.

More important than the projected dates for insolvency, he says, is the question of how severe the shortfall will be and how long Congress has to act before it arrives. The coronavirus will likely to mean a larger fiscal problem and less time to address it.

As I wrote at this same time last year, the problem facing Social Security is really one of time more than money. If changes can be phased in over a longer period of time, they will be less likely to disrupt retirement plans for current workers or beneficiaries. The last time Congress enacted substantial changes to Social Security was in 1983, and those changes won't be fully adopted until 2027.

It should be obvious that the longer Congress waits to act, the less time will be available for a gradual adjustment.

Any reforms should also consider two systemic problems within the Social Security system. When Social Security launched in 1935, the average life expectancy for Americans was 61. That means the average person died four years before qualifying for benefits. It was imagined as a safety net for the truly needy, not a conveyor belt to transfer wealth from the younger, working population to the older, relatively wealthier retired population.

As a result, the worker-to-beneficiary ratio has shifted dramatically. Last year, there were 64 million Americans getting benefits from Social Security, while 178 million people paid into the system via payroll taxes, according to the trustees' report. That's less than three workers for every beneficiary, a near-historic low.

Congress is going to have to consider all available options, says Blahous. That means changing eligibility ages, moderating benefit growth, and probably hiking payroll taxes too.

"We're not going to have enough from any one of those pots by themselves to be able to close the shortfall," says Blahous, "and that's even before taking into account the worsening that is going to occur as a result of this year's economic slowdown."

 

[DanteEstonia]

1 hour ago, Muda69 said:

Social Security Will Be Insolvent Even Sooner Than Expected, Thanks to COVID-19 Pandemic

https://reason.com/2020/04/24/social-security-will-be-insolvent-even-sooner-thanks-to-covid-19-pandemic/

 

Get rid of the cap on FICA. Problem solved!

[Muda69]

11 minutes ago, DanteEstonia said:

Get rid of the cap on FICA. Problem solved!

Good luck with that.

The real solution is to get rid of Social Security altogether.

 

[swordfish]

Adam Schiff on MSNBC (talking about the fact that President Trump wasn't impeached):

I don’t think we had any idea how much damage he would go on to do … There are 50,000 Americans now who are dead,  in a significant part because of his incompetence, because of his inability,” 

That statement is about as idiotic as someone who thinks the President "recommended" drinking Lysol.......

(If you believe all those 50,000 deaths are truly related to the virus.....)

Naw - this isn't political,.......

 

[DanteEstonia]

1 hour ago, Muda69 said:

 

The real solution is to get rid of Social Security altogether.

 

Can you think of a more short-sighted idea?

[Muda69]

56 minutes ago, DanteEstonia said:

Can you think of a more short-sighted idea?

If getting rid of an unconstitutional entity like the Social Security Administration is short-sighted, then no.

And I guess bankrupting the United States of America even more that it is with socialist policy after socialist policy are your "great ideas".  Talk about short-sighted..................

 

[Howe]

2 hours ago, swordfish said:

Adam Schiff on MSNBC (talking about the fact that President Trump wasn't impeached):

I don’t think we had any idea how much damage he would go on to do … There are 50,000 Americans now who are dead,  in a significant part because of his incompetence, because of his inability,” 

That statement is about as idiotic as someone who thinks the President "recommended" drinking Lysol.......

(If you believe all those 50,000 deaths are truly related to the virus.....)

Naw - this isn't political,.......

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 27, 2020 by Howe

[gonzoron]

18 minutes ago, Howe said:

 

 

He came back as a draft dodger with bone spurs?

[Muda69]

Lockdown enforcement is becoming more authoritarian.

 

https://reason.com/2020/04/27/undercover-cops-arrest-2-women-for-operating-home-beauty-businesses-in-violation-of-coronavirus-lockdown-order/

Quote

Undercover cops arrested two women in Laredo, Texas, for violating the city's COVID-19 shutdown order. The women, Ana Isabel Castro-Garcia and Brenda Stephanie Mata, had been operating prohibited cosmetology businesses from their home.

The Laredo lockdown mandates that "non-essential" businesses, including cosmetology services, must close. Police say the women were reported anonymously through the department's app.

"Both of the violators independently solicited customers via social media," the department told the Laredo Morning Times. "On both cases, an undercover officer working on the COVID-19 task force enforcement detail made contact with each solicitor to set up an appointment for a cosmetic, beauty service that is prohibited under the emergency ordinance." Police posing as customers then arrested both women in their homes.

Both women were charged with a Class B misdemeanor, which comes with a maximum potential penalty of 180 days in jail and a $1,000 fine. The two women were released on $500 personal recognizance bonds.

Their arrests are yet more evidence of law enforcement's self-defeating trend of arresting people for violating stay-at-home orders and social distancing protocols. (The Atlanta Constitution Journal has published a long list of examples here.) Arrests, by their very nature, require police and suspects to come into physical contact with each other. The people being arrested are then put in jails that have become breeding grounds for the novel coronavirus.

The longer local and state lockdown orders remain in place, the more authoritarian the enforcement seems to get.

 

[Muda69]

COVID-19 Is Teaching Us Decentralization Is Needed More Now Than Ever

https://mises.org/wire/covid-19-teaching-us-decentralization-needed-more-now-ever

Quote

In the increasingly polarized America, Black Swan moments like the COVID-19 pandemic have further confirmed growing divides in the country. Our textbooks would like us to believe that emergencies create fertile grounds for unity. But when you have a populace that is politically dividing itself even when it comes to the TV shows it watches, there comes a point when we have to start recognizing that the prospect of national unity is becoming more of a mirage as the days go by.

Amusingly, the COVID-19 saga has been host to some of the most flagrant political posturing in recent memory. Early in March (which feels like eons ago in today’s frenetic media cycle) New York City mayor de Blasio was telling people to go to the movies and have fun. Now, he’s done a complete 180, shutting down most private businesses and even calling for the nationalization of certain industries and begging the federal government for military aid to combat the epidemic.

It’s not a stretch to say that a collective psychosis has engulfed a large segment of the country ever since Donald Trump was elected in 2016. We have a media constantly throwing fits about every word the president utters and that thinks it’s engaging in a moral crusade of sorts when confronting him at press briefings. The media would have us believe that the debate about the appropriateness of using the term “China virus” is the civil rights battle of our times. Indeed, polarization is palpable in America’s body politic and its Fourth Estate is not helping make things any better. But pessimism should not be overdone when trying to grasp America’s contemporary delusions. Political crises can force politicians to go off their prepackaged talking points and become unusually candid in their political outlook.

On April 7, 2020, California governor Gavin Newsom described California as a “nation-state” that would take matters into its own hands to move itself forward. With most of the nation in a state of shutdown, there has been a lot of speculation about when everyday activities will go back to normal. However, some on the left are skeptical of the Trump administration's desire to reopen the economy on surprisingly federalist grounds. Michael Hiltzik of the Los Angeles Times did his best Ludwig von Mises impression in a recent column:

The truth is that Trump doesn’t have the legal or practical authority to dictate that restrictions be lifted for workplaces and commercial establishments, but neither do the governors.

The pace of any return to normality will be dictated by you and me—by consumers making their own judgments about when and under what circumstances it will be safe to resume old habits, and business owners running cost-benefit analyses on when a flow of customers will warrant reopening.

We are indeed living in the strangest of times when LA Times columnists are expressing sentiments that better belong in a passage of Human Action. The jury is still out on whether this is merely oppositional posturing from the Left, but any kind of conversation entailing the restoration of federalism is a welcome surprise.

The “authorized” right can generally be counted on to disappoint its constituents who genuinely believe in small government principles. To their credit, there have been some bright spots on their side in the present pandemic. States like Texas have gone out of their way to declare gun stores essential businesses and to deregulate several parts of its economy at a time where bureaucracy is impeding various vital economic functions.

Elected officials like State Representative Matt Gurtler in Georgia have raised the stakes by floating a proposal that would allow law-abiding Georgians to concealed carry anywhere. South Dakota governor Kristi Noem projected a stark contrast in her relatively lax approach to handling the pandemic. Jeff Deist used her example as the basis for several pragmatic measures that state governments can take to reopen their economies without throwing civil liberties into the wood chipper. No doubt there is much work to be done, but we can find glimmering signs of promise every now and then.

We need to move beyond the stale platitudes of trying to fix politics in DC. The chattering class’s lamentation about the divisiveness of politics is frankly silly. In some ways, polarization is our friend. The all-too-familiar ratchet effect has been largely put on hold thanks to the fact there’s no way to fast track certain power grabs such as gun control, thanks to the political division present in the current Congress. This is one case where partisanship can be used against itself in a way that keeps everyday people safe from DC’s antiliberty ruses. Gridlock is usually the next best option when no form of government reduction can be attained. Nevertheless, partisanship does have its limits in DC, as evidenced by the ease with which the monstrosity of a stimulus bill was able to reach Trump’s desk. Hence why decentralization is the x factor that Americans must tap into to break out of its managerial trance.

If Californians want to give up their rights during a quarantine, they can go ahead and knock themselves out. Other states will shine as beacons of reason as they turn to more practical alternatives that balance public health and basic freedoms. Thanks to decentralization (and the Tenth Amendment), America has multiple laboratories of policy experimentation across the nation. Competing jurisdictions allow us to see what works and what doesn’t.

Not all states will have the same policies. Others will enjoy certain liberties, while others will have fewer freedoms. That’s how the cookie will have to crumble. We must understand that the biggest threat we face in America isn’t the disparity in gun laws or tax policy between states like Texas and California, but rather the massive managerial state that has consolidated in Washington, DC, which engages in large-scale behavioral modification and usurpation of local governance. Extricating ourselves from this parasitic entity will be the greatest challenge of the twenty-first century, but it’s a battle worth taking.

Agreed.