CG/CA/RO/CHA - 4 Headed Monster Establishes Complete Dominance

[tango]

33 minutes ago, DT said:

Apparently you are not familiar with the concept of using reference material when writing about history.  I learned that in junior high

I referred to John Harrell's website to confirm your so-called Jasper football dynasty has won 3 Sectional titles and 1 Regional since the 2002 season when Coach Brewer retired.  See http://indianahsfootball.homestead.com/logs/Jasper.htm#loaded

Edited November 28, 2020 by tango

[Lysander]

7 minutes ago, tango said:

I referred to John Harrell's website to confirm your so-called Jasper football dynasty has won 3 Sectional titles and 1 Regional since the 2002 season when Coach Brewer retired.  See http://indianahsfootball.homestead.com/logs/Jasper.htm#loaded

Pshaw (do people say that anymore, btw?)!

What does an attorney know about research and reference material anyway?

[Justasportsfan]

1 hour ago, DT said:

Snider enrollment not on a good trend.  That will impact their ability to keep up long term

Few more strong handshakes will change that 😉

[Grover]

7 hours ago, temptation said:

What do the other 6A teams need to do (on/off the field) in order to close the gap?

Run a program rather than just a team.  

[temptation]

14 minutes ago, Grover said:

Run a program rather than just a team.  

Translation?

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, temptation said:

Translation?

Look at the junior level...Meaning elementary ages and up

[temptation]

1 minute ago, Brettlow said:

Look at the junior level...Meaning elementary ages and up

Gotta have tremendous administrative support and an amazing staff to make this possible.  Not all that easy at many places.

[Grover]

1 hour ago, temptation said:

Gotta have tremendous administrative support and an amazing staff to make this possible.  Not all that easy at many places.

Not all things require administrative buy-in.

[temptation]

1 minute ago, Grover said:

Not all things require administrative buy-in.

Directly from your head coach’s mouth.  He and Zwitt started at CG at the same time and created a vision.

You all love to “hate” DT but he’s spot on when it comes to administrative buy-in being a pillar for sustained success.

There is no other way to spin it.

[Yuccaguy]

Unless and UNTIL the Summit Athletic Conference sees itself as more than a 'feeder' for the lower classified schools that are also in the Conference; I would expect NOTHING to change, with respect to Football.  Decent records, gaudy numbers...early exits.  Upsets to teams they should obliterate.  

I will again say, that the ONLY way the Northern 6A schools can establish themselves as anything other than 'roadkill' on the way to LOS for the schools nearer to Indianapolis, Is to form a Football only conference and play EACH OTHER!  From the Region to SB/Elkhart/Mishawaka to the Fort!  .

[foxbat]

6 hours ago, Grover said:

Run a program rather than just a team.  

 

6 hours ago, Brettlow said:

Look at the junior level...Meaning elementary ages and up

I like it.

[Grover]

16 hours ago, temptation said:

Directly from your head coach’s mouth.  He and Zwitt started at CG at the same time and created a vision.

You all love to “hate” DT but he’s spot on when it comes to administrative buy-in being a pillar for sustained success.

There is no other way to spin it.

And the coaches who wait for administrative buy-in will continue to lose to the coaches who take full advantage of the boundaries they are given.

Edited November 29, 2020 by Grover

[temptation]

42 minutes ago, Grover said:

And the coaches who wait for administrative buy-in will continue to lose to the coaches who take full advantage of the boundaries they are given.

Huh?  Moore was a .500 coach in his first season at CG.  Administrative buy-in STARTS with the hiring of the right head coach.  AD’s and principals know what they are getting when they hire certain guys to run their football program.

Give em unlimited resources and stay the hell out of the way.  The great programs have figured this out.  Take BD and Warren for example.  They have changed coaches every 5-6 years over the last two decades and as a result they fall father and farther behind CG.

Sure, they came up and had some great seasons and won some titles (as you’d expect schools of their stature to do) but have also sprinkled in some disappointing seasons here and there.

Center Grove has had one losing season under Moore, and it was 15 years ago.

[Grover]

I'm well aware of Coach Moore's track record.  But it isn't all or nothing regarding administrative buy-in.  There are many things other MIC administrators give their football coaches that Coach Moore does not get.  (I won't get into details so don't ask.)  Coach could whine about it or he can do what he can within the boundaries he has been given.  I'll use one example because it is close to home: involvement in the school's youth program.  It doesn't require AD approval or school board authority.  If you want to change your program's culture you need to start with the little guys.  Join the league's board and take an active role.  Make sure the kids are being taught properly.  Instill a winning culture while they are young.

[temptation]

42 minutes ago, Grover said:

I'm well aware of Coach Moore's track record.  But it isn't all or nothing regarding administrative buy-in.  There are many things other MIC administrators give their football coaches that Coach Moore does not get.  (I won't get into details so don't ask.)  Coach could whine about it or he can do what he can within the boundaries he has been given.  I'll use one example because it is close to home: involvement in the school's youth program.  It doesn't require AD approval or school board authority.  If you want to change your program's culture you need to start with the little guys.  Join the league's board and take an active role.  Make sure the kids are being taught properly.  Instill a winning culture while they are young.

Great post.  While I am fully aware of what happens and what benefits are given to coaches at the MiC/mega schools, I’m also conscious that Moore has a pretty damn good gig at CG that is just not possible at other places.

I know my original question was “what can other 6A schools do to close the gap on CG” but your post made me think of how small school coaches would scoff at their benefits/daily schedule compared to their 6A brethren.

There are just not enough hours in the day for these little guys to do what you are asking without taking too much attention away from their current crop.

Edited November 29, 2020 by temptation

[southend]

22 hours ago, Yuccaguy said:

Unless and UNTIL the Summit Athletic Conference sees itself as more than a 'feeder' for the lower classified schools that are also in the Conference; I would expect NOTHING to change, with respect to Football.  Decent records, gaudy numbers...early exits.  Upsets to teams they should obliterate.  

I will again say, that the ONLY way the Northern 6A schools can establish themselves as anything other than 'roadkill' on the way to LOS for the schools nearer to Indianapolis, Is to form a Football only conference and play EACH OTHER!  From the Region to SB/Elkhart/Mishawaka to the Fort!  .

LOL, I will second this "feeder" comment for the declining SAC. It's been obvious for the last 4 or 5 years.

[BDGiant93]

On 11/28/2020 at 10:16 AM, DT said:

I am for splitting the 6A tournament into 2 separate tournaments, 6A and Super 6A.  The population centers in this state are fixed, so we need to recognize that and work within those parameters. 

Let's just split 6A into 32 different tournaments and give each school a state championship trophy.

[Guest DT]

2 minutes ago, BDGiant93 said:

Let's just split 6A into 32 different tournaments and give each school a state championship trophy.

Simpleton response.  You can do better.

[BDGiant93]

1 hour ago, DT said:

Simpleton response.  You can do better.

Probably not. 🤪

[BTF]

2 hours ago, BDGiant93 said:

Let's just split 6A into 32 different tournaments and give each school a state championship trophy.

I like the idea of splitting it into two. Doesn't make much sense for a school of 1800 (Snider) to have to go through schools of 3200 (Ben Davis) and 5000 (Carmel). It's fun trying, don't get me wrong. But at the end of the day, it's the high enrollment schools that get to thump their chest and proclaim "were the best."

[Grover]

Not much made of the fact that both of this year's finalists were in the smaller half of 6A enrollment.

[Lysander]

6 minutes ago, Grover said:

Not much made of the fact that both of this year's finalists were in the smaller half of 6A enrollment.

First thought that occurred to me.

[temptation]

8 minutes ago, Lysander said:

First thought that occurred to me.

Dare I say it?

Ah, why not!

SES > Enrollment

Edited November 30, 2020 by temptation

[BDGiant93]

52 minutes ago, BTF said:

I like the idea of splitting it into two. Doesn't make much sense for a school of 1800 (Snider) to have to go through schools of 3200 (Ben Davis) and 5000 (Carmel). It's fun trying, don't get me wrong. But at the end of the day, it's the high enrollment schools that get to thump their chest and proclaim "were the best."

If you split it again, then LN would be #16. How could it be fair for Lawrence North (2596) to go up against Carmel (5286). Let's split again...

 

How can Pike (3208) compete with Carmel (5286)...Let's split again.

 

 

[Lysander]

3 minutes ago, BDGiant93 said:

If you split it again, then LN would be #16. How could it be fair for Lawrence North (2596) to go up against Carmel (5286). Let's split again...

 

How can Pike (3208) compete with Carmel (5286)...Let's split again.

 

 

Yes, there is a circular inevitability to that thought process.