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Mercy Rule? No thanks

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10 hours ago, btownqbcoach said:

That's an error by the refs then 

More likely, an error by the clock operator. Here are proper clock mechanics for the mercy rule:

If at the halftime break, or anytime following, the score differential is 35 or more, the game clock will run continually, stopping only for scores, time outs, or injuries.  The only person to stop the clock during application of the mercy rule is the Referee (White Hat).

Following a touchdown, the clock will run through the PAT.  Following the PAT, the Referee will stop the game clock.  The continuous clock will resume at the ensuing kickoff with the kick. Normally, on a free kick, the game clock does not start until the kick is touched by the receivers. While the Mercy Rule is in effect, however, on a free kick the game clock will start as soon as the ball is kicked.

Following a successful Field Goal attempt, the Referee will stop the game clock.  The continuous game clock will resume at the ensuing kickoff and the game clock will continue to run. 

Following a safety, the Referee will stop the game clock.  The continuous game clock will resume at the ensuing kickoff and the clock will continue to run.

 

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One positive aspect of the mercy rule — at least, from my viewpoint — we won’t have the endless debates on the GID about whether someone ran up the score on someone else.

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9 hours ago, btownqbcoach said:

You've heard wrong. 

No.  You have it wrong.

Rules and Procedures

  1. Beginning with the second half of any high school football game, when the point differential between teams is at or reaches 35 points, the game clock shall convert to a running clock. A running clock is defined as a clock that does not stop during play with the exception of timeouts, scores and/or injuries.

  2. Once the running clock is implemented, the clock may not revert back to standard timing protocols regardless of the score of the contest.

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2 hours ago, Bobref said:

More likely, an error by the clock operator. Here are proper clock mechanics for the mercy rule:

If at the halftime break, or anytime following, the score differential is 35 or more, the game clock will run continually, stopping only for scores, time outs, or injuries.  The only person to stop the clock during application of the mercy rule is the Referee (White Hat).

Following a touchdown, the clock will run through the PAT.  Following the PAT, the Referee will stop the game clock.  The continuous clock will resume at the ensuing kickoff with the kick. Normally, on a free kick, the game clock does not start until the kick is touched by the receivers. While the Mercy Rule is in effect, however, on a free kick the game clock will start as soon as the ball is kicked.

Following a successful Field Goal attempt, the Referee will stop the game clock.  The continuous game clock will resume at the ensuing kickoff and the game clock will continue to run. 

Following a safety, the Referee will stop the game clock.  The continuous game clock will resume at the ensuing kickoff and the clock will continue to run.

 

Of course it could not be the referee's fault.  Why not say "I would have to see the film before determination is made on my part."  Throwing the clock operator under the bus is just plain BOBREF.  You have already stated many times that you think that most of them can't do the job correct.

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29 minutes ago, Major said:

Of course it could not be the referee's fault.  Why not say "I would have to see the film before determination is made on my part."  Throwing the clock operator under the bus is just plain BOBREF.  You have already stated many times that you think that most of them can't do the job correct.

I said “more likely” rather than “certainly,” which of course leaves open the possibility of crew error. I was speaking from my own experience as to which explanation had the higher probability. I’ll stand by that.

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17 hours ago, BTF said:

That would make it easier to justify. 

Or a mandatory meeting at midfield between the head coaches when the deficit reaches 42. Let the coach on the losing sideline decide.

That was unofficially the rule in the past. If both coaches agreed to any kind of running clock at any point we would grant it. The problem is some coaches refused to do it and collectively the coaches in the state didn't feel that was a good rule. They have been trying to agree on a plan for several years and finally found something they could agree on. I think it's a good change.

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4 hours ago, CaptainHook said:

No.  You have it wrong.

Rules and Procedures

  1. Beginning with the second half of any high school football game, when the point differential between teams is at or reaches 35 points, the game clock shall convert to a running clock. A running clock is defined as a clock that does not stop during play with the exception of timeouts, scores and/or injuries.

  2. Once the running clock is implemented, the clock may not revert back to standard timing protocols regardless of the score of the contest.

Do you even know why you quoted me? 

I said.. "it stops on scores" it does. Jesus. When one of the teams scores.. it stops, then once the kickoff happens it starts again. 

If you dont think it stops after scores, you've heard wrong. Idk what more you want me to say. 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.indystar.com/amp/3624767002

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3 hours ago, Bobref said:

I said “more likely” rather than “certainly,” which of course leaves open the possibility of crew error. I was speaking from my own experience as to which explanation had the higher probability. I’ll stand by that.

I’ll play Switzerland and say it was probably just an honest miscommunication between the two. Lol

If a ref told me it stops ‘after a score’ and I’m the clock operator, I would assume I stopped it after a TD. PAT’s are untimed. Actually reading the rule, it doesn’t stop until after the PAT. 

First week under a new rule. I remember similar issues with the :40/:25 that ironed themselves out after a week or two. 

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6 quarter rule as written is awful for small schools who still run 3 teams

like Rensselaer Central   the term "sub varsity" is gross and kills our Freshman and JV teams reps. 

For instance.   This week, instead of being able to use our Freshman for 1 quarter of JV ball as deemed fit, we cannot and have to save them for their 4 quarters of Freshman game on Thursday so they do not go over the "4 quarter of Sub Varsity play"  Used to be 5 quarters a week.  Took a quarter away from JV/Freshman teams who share players.   

I voiced this concern in May of last year to IHSAA, IFOA again this past week.   Its hard enough to find reps for freshman kids when so many teams in our area do not run 3 teams, we feel strongly that playing 3 full teams gives our kids competition and learn how to compete and work on their reps.   

We will make it work legally, it's unfortunate.   

But I could play a sophomore kid this week who played the entire 2nd half of a close game on Friday, 4 quarters on JV this Monday.  however he played exactly 3 total plays in the 2nd quarter when we had a player get set off because he was dry heaving.  So now he can play 1 quarter on Monday instead of 4 because of 3 plays...........  

Riddle me that one.   

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13 minutes ago, Coach Nowlin said:

6 quarter rule as written is awful for small schools who still run 3 teams

like Rensselaer Central   the term "sub varsity" is gross and kills our Freshman and JV teams reps. 

For instance.   This week, instead of being able to use our Freshman for 1 quarter of JV ball as deemed fit, we cannot and have to save them for their 4 quarters of Freshman game on Thursday so they do not go over the "4 quarter of Sub Varsity play"  Used to be 5 quarters a week.  Took a quarter away from JV/Freshman teams who share players.   

I voiced this concern in May of last year to IHSAA, IFOA again this past week.   Its hard enough to find reps for freshman kids when so many teams in our area do not run 3 teams, we feel strongly that playing 3 full teams gives our kids competition and learn how to compete and work on their reps.   

We will make it work legally, it's unfortunate.   

But I could play a sophomore kid this week who played the entire 2nd half of a close game on Friday, 4 quarters on JV this Monday.  however he played exactly 3 total plays in the 2nd quarter when we had a player get set off because he was dry heaving.  So now he can play 1 quarter on Monday instead of 4 because of 3 plays...........  

Riddle me that one.   

The 6 quarters is perfect for us because we don't have a JV team last year and before we wouldn't be able to sub until the 4th q. 

The lack of quarters was a bigger problem than the not having an automatic running clock. 

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1 hour ago, oldtimeqb said:

I’ll play Switzerland and say it was probably just an honest miscommunication between the two. Lol

If a ref told me it stops ‘after a score’ and I’m the clock operator, I would assume I stopped it after a TD. PAT’s are untimed. Actually reading the rule, it doesn’t stop until after the PAT. 

First week under a new rule. I remember similar issues with the :40/:25 that ironed themselves out after a week or two. 

You would think that there wouldn't be issues with the :40 play clock anymore. But I watched the Franklin Central clock operators botch both clocks on Friday. Early on, the play clock guy wasn't starting it up until the ball was set by the refs. And it seemed like the game clock guy just chose to start & stop whenever he felt like it. (Example: DC called timeout late in 1st half but clock kept running. Finally got it stopped & rest it to 0:57. Then he started it BEFORE DC ran the next play. Fortunately, a ref spotted that & they reset to 0:57 AGAIN)

Who knows? Maybe this 6A school can't find 2 local people to run the clocks & forced 1 guy to do them both.

So if the Franklin Central AD is reading this-- I go to every home game & I know what to do. Send me a note & I'll be there.

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5 hours ago, JustRules said:

That was unofficially the rule in the past. If both coaches agreed to any kind of running clock at any point we would grant it. The problem is some coaches refused to do it and collectively the coaches in the state didn't feel that was a good rule. They have been trying to agree on a plan for several years and finally found something they could agree on. I think it's a good change.

So if this wasn't just the IHSAA and the coaches had something to do with it, I'm surprised they didn't set the number at 42 or 49. 

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6 hours ago, Bobref said:

One positive aspect of the mercy rule — at least, from my viewpoint — we won’t have the endless debates on the GID about whether someone ran up the score on someone else.

Muda would have been in the ultimate pickle the other night in the game against Cathedral and Noblesville. Cathedral scored early in the 4th quarter to make it a 40-7 game as they had missed a PAT prior. Cathedral ended up going for 2 to achieve the 35 point threshold and they were successful. Game finished rather quickly and Cathedral was able to play their 2’s and 3’s the rest the way.

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12 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

Muda would have been in the ultimate pickle the other night in the game against Cathedral and Noblesville. Cathedral scored early in the 4th quarter to make it a 40-7 game as they had missed a PAT prior. Cathedral ended up going for 2 to achieve the 35 point threshold and they were successful. Game finished rather quickly and Cathedral was able to play their 2’s and 3’s the rest the way.

I don't care if a game has a running clock or not.  If you win by 35+ points you have run up the score.  End of story.

I'm not making a new thread just for this week but let's look at some of the 2019 Week #1 debacles:

 

Adams Central    40    Bellmont    0
Attica    50    Riverton Parke    6
Boonville    42    Washington    6
Carroll (Fort Wayne)    42    Fort Wayne Luers    0
Centerville    42    Cambridge City Lincoln    6     
Clinton Prairie    59    Park Tudor    12     
Delta    42    Muncie Central    0
Eastside    44    Heritage    0
Evansville North    49    Princeton    7
Fort Wayne Dwenger    41    Fort Wayne Wayne    6     
Fort Wayne Snider    51    Fort Wayne North    0    
Frontier    44    Anderson Prep Academy    0
Garrett    35    Prairie Heights    0
Gary West    56    Gary Roosevelt    6    
Gibson Southern    56    Forest Park    7     
Greensburg    52    Shelbyville    7
Heritage Christian    56    Indianapolis Manual    0
Homestead    43    Fort Wayne Northrop    6
Indianapolis Chatard    49    Brebeuf Jesuit    14    
Lapel    42    Elwood    6
Lawrence North    55    Perry Meridian    0     
Leo    36    Woodlan    0     
Michigan City    60    Griffith    7
Mishawaka Marian    51    South Bend Clay    0     
Mooresville    54    Lebanon    14
New Palestine    63    Kokomo    13     
North Daviess    42    Tecumseh    2     
North Newton    58    South Newton    0
North Vermillion    43    Owen Valley    8
Norwell    47    Jay County    0     
Oldenburg Academy    42    Rock Creek Academy    6     
Osceola Grace    49    Lake Station    0     
Parke Heritage    52    Seeger    7
Plainfield    42    Greenfield-Central    6     
South Adams    40    Winchester    0    
Traders Point Christian    56    Noblesville HomeSchool    8     
Warsaw    52    Huntington North    13     
Western Boone    41    Sheridan    6

And the What The Heck Game of the Week goes to:
Lafayette Jeff    74    West Lafayette    66     

This game must have taken 4+ hours to play. How exciting...........
 

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1 minute ago, Muda69 said:

I don't care if a game has a running clock or not.  If you win by 35+ points you have run up the score.  End of story.

I'm not making a new thread just for this week but let's look at some of the 2019 Week #1 debacles:

 

Adams Central    40    Bellmont    0
Attica    50    Riverton Parke    6
Boonville    42    Washington    6
Carroll (Fort Wayne)    42    Fort Wayne Luers    0
Centerville    42    Cambridge City Lincoln    6     
Clinton Prairie    59    Park Tudor    12     
Delta    42    Muncie Central    0
Eastside    44    Heritage    0
Evansville North    49    Princeton    7
Fort Wayne Dwenger    41    Fort Wayne Wayne    6     
Fort Wayne Snider    51    Fort Wayne North    0    
Frontier    44    Anderson Prep Academy    0
Garrett    35    Prairie Heights    0
Gary West    56    Gary Roosevelt    6    
Gibson Southern    56    Forest Park    7     
Greensburg    52    Shelbyville    7
Heritage Christian    56    Indianapolis Manual    0
Homestead    43    Fort Wayne Northrop    6
Indianapolis Chatard    49    Brebeuf Jesuit    14    
Lapel    42    Elwood    6
Lawrence North    55    Perry Meridian    0     
Leo    36    Woodlan    0     
Michigan City    60    Griffith    7
Mishawaka Marian    51    South Bend Clay    0     
Mooresville    54    Lebanon    14
New Palestine    63    Kokomo    13     
North Daviess    42    Tecumseh    2     
North Newton    58    South Newton    0
North Vermillion    43    Owen Valley    8
Norwell    47    Jay County    0     
Oldenburg Academy    42    Rock Creek Academy    6     
Osceola Grace    49    Lake Station    0     
Parke Heritage    52    Seeger    7
Plainfield    42    Greenfield-Central    6     
South Adams    40    Winchester    0    
Traders Point Christian    56    Noblesville HomeSchool    8     
Warsaw    52    Huntington North    13     
Western Boone    41    Sheridan    6

And the What The Heck Game of the Week goes to:
Lafayette Jeff    74    West Lafayette    66     

This game must have taken 4+ hours to play. How exciting...........
 

Loser

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30 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

I don't care if a game has a running clock or not.  If you win by 35+ points you have run up the score.  End of story.

I'm not making a new thread just for this week but let's look at some of the 2019 Week #1 debacles:

 

And the What The Heck Game of the Week goes to:
Lafayette Jeff    74    West Lafayette    66     

This game must have taken 4+ hours to play. How exciting...........
 

Are you implying that this game was a debacle because of the high score? We are talking about the defending 3A champs vs a top 10 6A team. Obviously, the offenses dominated the defenses but they are both clearly very good teams. Would you call a 6-0 game a debacle just because the defenses controlled the game? 

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5 minutes ago, slice60 said:

Are you implying that this game was a debacle because of the high score? We are talking about the defending 3A champs vs a top 10 6A team. Obviously, the offenses dominated the defenses but they are both clearly very good teams. Would you call a 6-0 game a debacle just because the defenses controlled the game? 

Yes, I am.

Frankly a 6-0 game would be much more exciting, and a better football game.

 

 

38 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

Loser

Thank you for your support.

 

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24 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

Yes, I am.

Frankly a 6-0 game would be much more exciting, and a better football game.

 

Those teams should be ashamed of themselves. I assume you will start a petition to take that state title trophy away from West Lafayette.  Be sure to take away Snider's 2015 trophy when they beat New Pal 64-61.

Or should we just put these teams on the Contraction List that always pops up around here?

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16 minutes ago, slice60 said:

Those teams should be ashamed of themselves. I assume you will start a petition to take that state title trophy away from West Lafayette.  Be sure to take away Snider's 2015 trophy when they beat New Pal 64-61.

Or should we just put these teams on the Contraction List that always pops up around here?

Why would I start such a petition?  A completely nonsensical statement your your part.

And you clearly don't understand the idea behind program contraction.  Please educate yourself first instead of making generally incoherent, reactionary, rants.

 

 

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5 hours ago, btownqbcoach said:

Do you even know why you quoted me? 

I said.. "it stops on scores" it does. Jesus. When one of the teams scores.. it stops, then once the kickoff happens it starts again. 

If you dont think it stops after scores, you've heard wrong. Idk what more you want me to say. 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.indystar.com/amp/3624767002

Sorry! I misunderstood what you were saying originally.  Then you quoted me about what happens when it gets back under 35 points and things went off the rails.

As discussed, in the NP @ Kokomo the rule was done correctly.  It did not stop after a TD.  It ran during the extra point.  And then the clock stopped to prepare for kickoff.

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4 hours ago, Muda69 said:

I don't care if a game has a running clock or not.  If you win by 35+ points you have run up the score.  End of story.
 

I would fire a coach if he took the foot off the gas up 35 in the first half. Teams have come back from that far down. Up 35 half way through the 3rd quarter? I guess I could live with that. A good football coach goes for the jugular when up 35. Maybe take the foot off the gas when up 42 or 49. 

3 hours ago, Muda69 said:

Yes, I am.Frankly a 6-0 game would be much more exciting, and a better football game.

It really depends or whether or not you enjoy watching offense or defense. Everyone is entitled to their opinion with regard to what a good football game is. 

When Snider beat New Pal 64-61, the owner of the Indianapolis Colts stated that that may have been the most exciting game he's ever seen at any level. 

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5 hours ago, Muda69 said:

I don't care if a game has a running clock or not.  If you win by 35+ points you have run up the score.  End of story.

That might be the most absurd thing I've read on this forum.  You can't possibly believe that? What's your solution then?  Once a team is up by whatever @Muda69 seems too much they must take knee?  Don't ever allow your backups to try?  Or just simply end the game when a team is up by whatever score you think is too much?  Not trying to be a jerk here but come on.  

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9 hours ago, BTF said:

I would fire a coach if he took the foot off the gas up 35 in the first half. Teams have come back from that far down. Up 35 half way through the 3rd quarter? I guess I could live with that. A good football coach goes for the jugular when up 35. Maybe take the foot off the gas when up 42 or 49. 

"To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women!"    Nice lessons for children, right?

 

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