Help Out the Officials

[Bobref]

One of the things the Indiana Football Officials Association does to support its members in their never-ending effort to get better is produce and distribute a weekly training video. It has 10 or so video clips of plays from the preceding week’s games that illustrate mechanics issues, rules interpretations, and judgment calls. This video is distributed to the 700 or so members of the IFOA — most of the people you see wearing stripes on Friday nights. These weekly videos are an important part of our in-season training.

The IFOA needs your help. On a given Friday night there are 150+ games. They produce a wealth of useful information for officials. The problem is finding those plays in that mountain of video. This is where you come in. If you had an unusual play in a game you saw, let us know about it by describing it on this thread. Let us know the game, the approximate point in the game when the play occurs, and a brief description. We’re interested in almost anything: onside kicks, pass interference, punt returns, goal line plays, big hits … the list goes on an on.

Lots of people complain about officiating. Here’s your opportunity to do something about it. These videos help us to be better, more consistent. If you’re reluctant to mention a play openly, feel free to message me. 

[Julio]

This is usually not seen on the video, but could you please verify where the chain gang is suppose to be when they move the chains?  There is an official's box, a coaches, box and the players box, when they are moving what box are they to be in?  We have had numerous times where they run into coaches, who are in the correct box, and they yell at us to get out of their way.  Seems that they should use the officials box to move the chain.

[Bobref]

7 minutes ago, Julio said:

This is usually not seen on the video, but could you please verify where the chain gang is suppose to be when they move the chains?  There is an official's box, a coaches, box and the players box, when they are moving what box are they to be in?  We have had numerous times where they run into coaches, who are in the correct box, and they yell at us to get out of their way.  Seems that they should use the officials box to move the chain.

It can get pretty hectic there, especially when there are multiple substitutions, and people running in and out of the restricted area. We can’t play without moving them, so the basic rule is that they go where they need to go based on the situation, and everyone else yields the right of way. I’ve seen many occasions where things are so busy in the restricted area, such as a change of possession, that the chain gang has to go out on the field to get a clear path.

[vicvinegar]

15 hours ago, Bobref said:

One of the things the Indiana Football Officials Association does to support its members in their never-ending effort to get better is produce and distribute a weekly training video. It has 10 or so video clips of plays from the preceding week’s games that illustrate mechanics issues, rules interpretations, and judgment calls. This video is distributed to the 700 or so members of the IFOA — most of the people you see wearing stripes on Friday nights. These weekly videos are an important part of our in-season training.

The IFOA needs your help. On a given Friday night there are 150+ games. They produce a wealth of useful information for officials. The problem is finding those plays in that mountain of video. This is where you come in. If you had an unusual play in a game you saw, let us know about it by describing it on this thread. Let us know the game, the approximate point in the game when the play occurs, and a brief description. We’re interested in almost anything: onside kicks, pass interference, punt returns, goal line plays, big hits … the list goes on an on.

Lots of people complain about officiating. Here’s your opportunity to do something about it. These videos help us to be better, more consistent. If you’re reluctant to mention a play openly, feel free to message me. 

I tried to message you and it says you cannot receive messages. 

[Bobref]

4 hours ago, vicvinegar said:

I tried to message you and it says you cannot receive messages. 

Better clean out that mailbox. Thanks for the heads up.

[Coach Wilhelm]

8-25-23 Yorktown vs. Muncie Central Play #68

Muncie Central FG Attempt. Yorktown blocks it, and it lands past the line of scrimmage. Players on both teams freeze for a second. Yorktown player picks it up and returns it for a TD. Although we've talked about this rule for years with our kids, this is the first time I've seen it happen in one of our high school games.

[Julio]

On 8/28/2023 at 10:39 AM, Bobref said:

It can get pretty hectic there, especially when there are multiple substitutions, and people running in and out of the restricted area. We can’t play without moving them, so the basic rule is that they go where they need to go based on the situation, and everyone else yields the right of way. I’ve seen many occasions where things are so busy in the restricted area, such as a change of possession, that the chain gang has to go out on the field to get a clear path.

So they can run into coaches on the sidelines and then tell the referees, who then proceed to throw a flag for a sideline warning on the coaching staff?

[JustRules]

1 minute ago, Julio said:

So they can run into coaches on the sidelines and then tell the referees, who then proceed to throw a flag for a sideline warning on the coaching staff?

The white area where the chain crew moves is NOT for coaches. They are allowed by rule to have 3 coaches in that area between plays, but that is NOT the coach's area. It's the official's area to work and the chain crew is part of the officiating crew. Many schools will have an extra 2-yard belt behind that for the coaches and they will put the players behind that. That is not a rule thing though. If coaches are going to come into the restricted area (the 2-yard white area along the sideline. they need do so without getting in the way of the chain crew. During this dead ball period though they would not get a flag for interference unless they blatantly and intentionally did something to the chain crew or other officials.

[WCGrad92]

Reading his post, he stated that the coaches were in their box, not the officials box, and if ran into while in teh COACHES box, can they tell the ref to get a flag? Not in the Officials box.

[JustRules]

10 minutes ago, WCGrad92 said:

Reading his post, he stated that the coaches were in their box, not the officials box, and if ran into while in teh COACHES box, can they tell the ref to get a flag? Not in the Officials box.

The thing is there is no "coaches box". There is the restricted area and team area, but many coaches feel the restricted area is their area and this is the area where the chain crew operates so I assumed that was the area he was referring to. I could be wrong. Teams get excited over there and often get in the way unintentionally. It's not uncommon though for chain crews to have to move through several coaches and players to get to the next line to gain. Since only players entering the field as a substitute and 3 coaches are supposed to be there, it should be fairly clear. But often it's not. It's not likely something that would get flagged. If the chain crew is trying to get into the team area for some reason, that's on them if it gets tight. I've never seen a chain crew try to move in the team area though.

[JustRules]

6 hours ago, Coach Wilhelm said:

8-25-23 Yorktown vs. Muncie Central Play #68

Muncie Central FG Attempt. Yorktown blocks it, and it lands past the line of scrimmage. Players on both teams freeze for a second. Yorktown player picks it up and returns it for a TD. Although we've talked about this rule for years with our kids, this is the first time I've seen it happen in one of our high school games.

Great play! Hopefully they include this. This is a great example of why I tell coaches and players by rule a FG is generally the same as a punt but it can score 3 points for the kicking team. If this had been downed at the spot of recovery, it would have been your ball at that spot 1st and 10. Most think it would return to the previous spot or the 20, but that's now how the HS rule is written. Just like if you punted it to the R5 and downed it, that's where R will get the ball.

[Bobref]

1 hour ago, Julio said:

So they can run into coaches on the sidelines and then tell the referees, who then proceed to throw a flag for a sideline warning on the coaching staff?

Give the Linesman a little credit. 

[Impartial_Observer]

6 minutes ago, Bobref said:

Give the Linesman a little credit. 

OK, but never the U!

[tango]

2 hours ago, JustRules said:

Great play! Hopefully they include this. This is a great example of why I tell coaches and players by rule a FG is generally the same as a punt but it can score 3 points for the kicking team. If this had been downed at the spot of recovery, it would have been your ball at that spot 1st and 10. Most think it would return to the previous spot or the 20, but that's now how the HS rule is written. Just like if you punted it to the R5 and downed it, that's where R will get the ball.

If only somebody had told Leon Lett...

[Trojan67]

Got brought in another thread earlier today. Triton vs LaVille, :06 seconds left of the first half, LaVille fair catches at the -48 and initiates the free kick rule inside 10 seconds. A really great teaching moment for all the refs, the coaches, and the players. 

[Coach Nowlin]

On 8/29/2023 at 1:45 PM, Impartial_Observer said:

OK, but never the U!

That's where the Older Fatmen go!!!   So I've been told!!!   

[olinecoach]

On 8/29/2023 at 9:45 PM, Trojan67 said:

Got brought in another thread earlier today. Triton vs LaVille, :06 seconds left of the first half, LaVille fair catches at the -48 and initiates the free kick rule inside 10 seconds. A really great teaching moment for all the refs, the coaches, and the players. 

This rule blows our players minds every year when I explain it to them! Not had a chance to use it yet, but would be a fun situation!

[AW0352]

On 8/29/2023 at 8:45 PM, Trojan67 said:

Got brought in another thread earlier today. Triton vs LaVille, :06 seconds left of the first half, LaVille fair catches at the -48 and initiates the free kick rule inside 10 seconds. A really great teaching moment for all the refs, the coaches, and the players. 

What is the official rule on the free kick?

[JustRules]

1 hour ago, AW0352 said:

What is the official rule on the free kick?

They are allowed to line up in a free kick formation (same as a kickoff). Put the ball on a tee and the receiving team has to be at least 10 yards from the ball. If the kick goes through the uprights they are awarded 3 points. It needs to happen near the end of a half. The team needs to have fair caught a kick. And they need to be close enough their kicker has a fighting chance to make it. It's very rare for all those items to line up at the same time.

[Punttheball]

2 hours ago, JustRules said:

They are allowed to line up in a free kick formation (same as a kickoff). Put the ball on a tee and the receiving team has to be at least 10 yards from the ball. If the kick goes through the uprights they are awarded 3 points. It needs to happen near the end of a half. The team needs to have fair caught a kick. And they need to be close enough their kicker has a fighting chance to make it. It's very rare for all those items to line up at the same time.

Can the ball be moved to the middle of the field or to a hash? For example, the ball was caught on the left hash at the 40 yard line. Can that ball be positioned in the middle of the field for the free kick?  We practice this every Thursday night, but this is always a question for us.

[Trojan67]

7 minutes ago, Punttheball said:

Can the ball be moved to the middle of the field or to a hash? For example, the ball was caught on the left hash at the 40 yard line. Can that ball be positioned in the middle of the field for the free kick?  We practice this every Thursday night, but this is always a question for us.

From my understanding on the rule, the ball cannot be moved to the middle. 

[oldtimeqb]

2 hours ago, JustRules said:

They are allowed to line up in a free kick formation (same as a kickoff). Put the ball on a tee and the receiving team has to be at least 10 yards from the ball. If the kick goes through the uprights they are awarded 3 points. It needs to happen near the end of a half. The team needs to have fair caught a kick. And they need to be close enough their kicker has a fighting chance to make it. It's very rare for all those items to line up at the same time.

Completely agree about the rarity of the perfect situation.

Does the clock start when touched by a member of the receiving team?  

Touchback if it reaches the endzone, correct?  Otherwise it's treated like a Kickoff?

 

[AW0352]

Why does it have to be near the end of a half? 

[foxbat]

4 hours ago, AW0352 said:

Why does it have to be near the end of a half? 

Mainly because, if you fair catch a punt, you typically go on offense.  If you've got two minutes left in the half, then you probably see about getting closer and then kicking a closer field goal or trying to get a TD.  If you've got about 10 seconds left in the half and you fair catch that thing around the opponent's 35, you've got a shot at a 52-yard field goal with no rush.  There's a decent number of kickoff kickers that can put a ball through the uprights at 50 yards with no opposing rush, snap, and set needed along with a run-up.  Likely to take that as opposed to taking a shot at the endzone that results in 5 seconds left on the clock with an incomplete pass and a 52-yard attempt with a rush.  As others have said, it's a pretty unique situation that needs to come together to make it a truly viable option.

[foxbat]

14 hours ago, oldtimeqb said:

Completely agree about the rarity of the perfect situation.

Does the clock start when touched by a member of the receiving team?  

Touchback if it reaches the endzone, correct?  Otherwise it's treated like a Kickoff?

 

I believe it's actually treated more like a punt rather than a kickoff.  If it goes out of bounds, for example, on a kickoff it's a penalty on a kicking team.  In a field goal situation, it's just a dead ball at the point where it goes out of bounds ... and the kicker gets razzed mercilessly on the bus ride home for such a shank.