Live From The State Finals

[JustRules]

3 hours ago, gindie said:

Illegal participation occurred in 2 different games today, it seems both times it wasn't called until the offense had lined up ready to go.  Please explain.

It was illegal substitution and not illegal participation. The referee and umpire sometimes can't get their count until the offense breaks the huddle or lines up. If they get a count of 12, they'll do another count to make sure the first count is right (I've often had a 12 count and on second count had only 11). If nobody has tried to leave the field by then, they'll shut it down for an illegal substitution. If the offense snaps the ball before you are able to get the count, and they play with 12, then it's a foul for illegal participation. The difference is 5-years vs. 15 so it's a pretty significant difference. Always better to get the count before and shut it down if possible.

[FastpacedO]

4 hours ago, JustRules said:

It was illegal substitution and not illegal participation. The referee and umpire sometimes can't get their count until the offense breaks the huddle or lines up. If they get a count of 12, they'll do another count to make sure the first count is right (I've often had a 12 count and on second count had only 11). If nobody has tried to leave the field by then, they'll shut it down for an illegal substitution. If the offense snaps the ball before you are able to get the count, and they play with 12, then it's a foul for illegal participation. The difference is 5-years vs. 15 so it's a pretty significant difference. Always better to get the count before and shut it down if possible.

I thought it was a rather clean game penalty wise for both teams. Probably makes the officials a little more relieved when the teams make it easy for them and there really is no controversy. The only play I could say was anywhere near questionable is the defensive pass interference against Westfield. I honestly on that play can see why it was called and could see if it wasn’t it was that close.

[Bobref]

7 hours ago, gindie said:

Illegal participation occurred in 2 different games today, it seems both times it wasn't called until the offense had lined up ready to go.  Please explain.

I believe it was illegal substitution, not illegal participation. For the offense, when a sub comes in, the replaced player must start to leave the field within 3 seconds, if he doesn’t, it’s illegal substitution, a 5 yd., dead ball penalty. Illegal participation is a 15 yd. live ball foul.

[Bobref]

Three more big games on tap today!

IMO, the people in the stripes had a pretty good day yesterday. I saw only one (what I would consider) major mistake: a mis-enforced penalty in the 4A game, that had no effect on the outcome at all. Hope I’m not jinxing the 3 great crews we have working today. But I know them, and have great confidence in them all.

[AW0352]

 Can/will you say where all six crews are from?    Are they spread out amongst the state? Or does that have no bearing on who is selected? 

[Bobref]

40 minutes ago, AW0352 said:

 Can/will you say where all six crews are from?    Are they spread out amongst the state? Or does that have no bearing on who is selected? 

Location is not a factor in the selection/advancement process. The six crews working this weekend are from all over the state.

[Bobref]

Judson strikes first, after pinning Providence deep in their own territory. Fumble, recovered in the end zone. 2 pt. try fails. Bluejays 6 Pioneers 0 8:21 of the 1st.

 

[WestfieldRocks]

13 hours ago, Bobref said:

Westfield outsmarts itself by trying a goofy rugby punt on 4th down. Blocked, scoop, and score. 2 pt. try no good. 22-10 8:44 of the 4th.

That rugby punt was used quite often during the season, but I don't think that was the time to try it, especially deep in your own end.

[WestfieldRocks]

3 hours ago, Bobref said:

Three more big games on tap today!

IMO, the people in the stripes had a pretty good day yesterday. I saw only one (what I would consider) major mistake: a mis-enforced penalty in the 4A game, that had no effect on the outcome at all. Hope I’m not jinxing the 3 great crews we have working today. But I know them, and have great confidence in them all.

Question: What is the high school rule on a safety? I think it's different between college and the NFL. In the 3rd quarter, after a Westfield punt pinned Brownsburg back to their one yard line, two Westfield defenders tackled the QB clearly behind the end zone line. However, the official put the ball back at the one yard line. Now that was at the opposite end where we were seated, but the replay sure looked like he never got out of the endzone, nor did the ball. That two points would have given Westfield the chance to put that game into OT with a field goal at the end, instead of the failed pass into the endzone. 

I do agree that this game was well officiated, and also well played. Few penalities, and no turnovers by either team until that last play of the game interception in the end zone.

[wabashalwaysfights]

3 minutes ago, WestfieldRocks said:

Question: What is the high school rule on a safety? I think it's different between college and the NFL. In the 3rd quarter, after a Westfield punt pinned Brownsburg back to their one yard line, two Westfield defenders tackled the QB clearly behind the end zone line. However, the official put the ball back at the one yard line. Now that was at the opposite end where we were seated, but the replay sure looked like he never got out of the endzone, nor did the ball. That two points would have given Westfield the chance to put that game into OT with a field goal at the end, instead of the failed pass into the endzone. 

I do agree that this game was well officiated, and also well played. Few penalities, and no turnovers by either team until that last play of the game interception in the end zone.

Bob will correct me if I'm wrong, but all the ball has to do in order to NOT be a safety is break the plain of the goal line. Therefore, I would assume that once the ball breaks the plain, it must be placed in such a anger that it not touch the goalline at all, hence the one yard line? Either that or you saw the replay wrong 🤪

[adambetz]

Gameplan "Kemp is the best athletic and we're gonna let him eat" is looking pretty solid rn 

[Bobref]

6 minutes ago, WestfieldRocks said:

Question: What is the high school rule on a safety? I think it's different between college and the NFL. In the 3rd quarter, after a Westfield punt pinned Brownsburg back to their one yard line, two Westfield defenders tackled the QB clearly behind the end zone line. However, the official put the ball back at the one yard line. Now that was at the opposite end where we were seated, but the replay sure looked like he never got out of the endzone, nor did the ball. That two points would have given Westfield the chance to put that game into OT with a field goal at the end, instead of the failed pass into the endzone. 

I do agree that this game was well officiated, and also well played. Few penalities, and no turnovers by either team until that last play of the game interception in the end zone.

My view of the play was the QB’s forward progress was stopped with the entire ball in the field of play, and then he was pushed back into the end zone. 

[adambetz]

Pass just before Providence's second touchdown was incomplete. Ruled a catch

Edited November 30, 2024 by adambetz

[Bobref]

1 minute ago, wabashalwaysfights said:

Bob will correct me if I'm wrong, but all the ball has to do in order to NOT be a safety is break the plain of the goal line. Therefore, I would assume that once the ball breaks the plain, it must be placed in such a anger that it not touch the goalline at all, hence the one yard line? Either that or you saw the replay wrong 🤪

The entire ball has to be out of the end zone or it is a safety. Not just the foremost point of the ball.

Providence with a nice long drive to take a 14-6 lead with 11:30 left in the half.

[wabashalwaysfights]

1 minute ago, Bobref said:

The entire ball has to be out of the end zone or it is a safety. Not just the foremost point of the ball.

Won't be the last time I'm wrong, thanks Bob.

[WestfieldRocks]

3 minutes ago, wabashalwaysfights said:

Won't be the last time I'm wrong, thanks Bob.

Thanks for all of the explanations. With the ball on the one yard line, the QB takes the snap in the end zone. It sure didn't look like he ever got out of there, but that again was looking at the stadium replay screen.  Would have been huge for Westfield it it had been ruled other wise. 

[Bobref]

Providence sneaks another one in with 2 seconds left in the half. 21-6 Providence. Judson has no answer for the Providence QB.

[oldtimeqb]

Good to see the 7th official in the stands. He is having a good game. 😀

[WWFan]

9 minutes ago, Bobref said:

Providence sneaks another one in with 2 seconds left in the half. 21-6 Providence. Judson has no answer for the Providence QB.

Pretty much sums up Providence entire post season run. 

[gindie]

Are travel arrangements for the team (hotel pick, etc) done by the schools themselves?  The TV guy keeps mentioning seeing players in the hotel.

[oldtimeqb]

5 hours ago, Bobref said:

Three more big games on tap today!

IMO, the people in the stripes had a pretty good day yesterday. I saw only one (what I would consider) major mistake: an mis-enforced penalty in the 4A game, that had no effect on the outcome at all. Hope I’m not jinxing the 3 great crews we have working today. But I know them, and have great confidence in them all.

You jinxed them Bob. 

Although I appreciate these refs admitting the inadvertent whistle unlike the officials of the Raiders - Chiefs game. 

[NumbersNvrLie]

5 minutes ago, oldtimeqb said:

You jinxed them Bob. 

Although I appreciate these refs admitting the inadvertent whistle unlike the officials of the Raiders - Chiefs game. 

Really sad game was just getting good!

[260AC]

Everybody in the stadium knows the refs gave away the game.This will be a fun discussion for the next year.

[littledog]

3 minutes ago, NumbersNvrLie said:

Really sad game was just getting good!

Yeah that was a momentum killer. With a hurt QB I fear the jays don’t have enough weapons on the outside to score quick enough. 

[Gridiron_Junkie]

Well, no public sweep this year!