Coaches Confidential: How would you make IHSAA football better?

[Muda69]

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/high-school/2023/08/09/indiana-high-school-football-coaches-want-ihsaa-tournament-seeded-playoffs-sectionals/70397423007/

(Note: story is behind a paywall)

Quote

 

We granted anonymity to high school football coaches in Central Indiana to answer four questions for us before the start of the 2023 football season.

The fourth: What change would you make to high school football to make it a better experience?

“I think we should move start times to 7:30 to play in less sun and more under the lights early in the season.”

***

“Put private schools in their own state tournament or make them permanently play a class up above their size.”

***

“Eliminate kickoff. Make it similar to how the XFL does it.”

***

“1) Private schools must play no lower than 3A and success factor is still in play; 2) Stop policing the eye black, arm bands and knee pads above knees by the referees; 3) Split all classes up evenly to 30-32 teams in each class (potentially 10 classes) and have state championship for 10 different classes; 4) Start the season after Labor Day weekend.”

***

“I think we need to put a limit on the number of camps athletes can go to from the months of June and July.”

***

“In my opinion, high school football is still one of the best activities that young people can compete in. Learning to work hard, be disciplined, overcome challenges and doing it all for the love of your teammates and community is special. Football rallies entire communities together and emphasizes common goals and teamwork in an era of selfishness and clout. If there was one thing I would change it would be seeding the tournament. I don’t mind that everyone makes the playoffs, but making the regular season more meaningful by seeding the tournament based on the Sagarin Ratings would be an easy change."

***

“Not allow the offseason practices (winter, spring, summer) that the IHSAA has decided to allow; year-round practice encourages single-sport participation.”

***

“I think making your season record count for something in the postseason would be a great and welcomed change.”

***

“Seeding the postseason tournament seems like a necessary step. I can’t help but wonder in how many classes does a top-5 team in the state get eliminated in the first or second round of sectionals because they happen to be in the same sectional as the eventual state champion. We need a way to reward the best teams in the state and not just celebrate teams because of their geographic location and the lack of competition around them.”

 

***

“Seed the tournament. Allow more kids to dress for the state championship.”

***

“I think high school football is in a good place.”

***

“Raise a high standard for everyone. Excuses for parents, kids, and coaches are increasing. Have those tough conversations and hold them accountable. The game itself will be better. This game is not only about winning (even though it is the best way to achieve many, if not everything but winning), but to grow young men and women through the experiences they have in this game. It's a learning experience more than X’s and O’s.”

***

“Make the regular season eight games and give teams an option to play nine or have a bye. I’d like to seed the sectionals. Keep the same eight teams, but rank them based on record.”

***

“I think IHSAA does a great job but for sure 6A should be seeded for the playoffs and maybe others as well.”

***

“Greatest game around. I wouldn’t change a thing!”

***

“Not let kids transfer from school to school because things don’t go their way. If a kid takes a year off, fine, but there are too many shady situations that slide under IHSAA nose because schools don’t do their due diligence to: 1) deny a kid eligibility they know isn’t living in their district but used phony address to not sit or 2) schools signing off on kids transferring when things don’t go their way.”

***

“The experience is what you make it for your players and program. I wouldn’t change anything.”

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“Seeding the playoffs.”

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“I would have National Federation separate academies (or any school/state that is legally allowed to recruit) from high schools who have to follow recruiting rules.”

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“I think good coaches are already doing everything we can to keep high school football afloat.”

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“Seed the tournament.”

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“Look into the limited contact periods in the winter and spring. Football has become a year-round experience for players and coaches. I worry about the burnout factor for coaches and their families.”

......

And the list goes on, subscribe to the Star to read all of them.    Lots of calls for playoff seeding in these comments.    

[OldschoolFB]

Get rid of the success factor.  Or have schools play down as opposed to up. 

[oldtimeqb]

1 hour ago, Muda69 said:

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/high-school/2023/08/09/indiana-high-school-football-coaches-want-ihsaa-tournament-seeded-playoffs-sectionals/70397423007/

(Note: story is behind a paywall)

And the list goes on, subscribe to the Star to read all of them.    Lots of calls for playoff seeding in these comments.    

I can see why a fully seeded state tournament would be popular, especially amongst the Indy donut coaches.  I agree 6A would be the perfect place to do it.  It only works if there is some sort of geographic restrictions. 

Just looking at Illinois last year, their playoffs resulted in several St. Louis suburb schools (East St. Louis, Belleville, Collinsville) playing Chicago suburb schools - a 5 hour drive by car - for first round playoff games.  East St Louis drove to Oak Lawn, IL to win 71-0.   At least the win made the 10 hour round trip worth it, I guess. .  

[whiteshoes]

Saturday semi-states at neutral sites.

[npcougar15]

I wouldn't change too much about the current season except:

1. Seed sectionals 1-4 (in 8 team sectionals) then random draw the other 4. better seed gets home field advantage. Once you hit regionals and or both teams are seeded it goes to the current format to determine home team.

 

The only other thing I'd think about touching is something with the privates. Don't know if that means they automatically play up a class? Create 2 classes with privates (small and big school) and have their own tournament? Don't know what the answer is exactly but it's time to get creative

 

[BDGiant93]

43 minutes ago, oldtimeqb said:

I can see why a fully seeded state tournament would be popular, especially amongst the Indy donut coaches.  I agree 6A would be the perfect place to do it.  It only works if there is some sort of geographic restrictions. 

WC's Mike Kirschner has long advocated for a 1-32 seeding in the 6A tournament by the Sagarins. Home team is the higher seed. 

[BDGiant93]

32 minutes ago, whiteshoes said:

Saturday semi-states at neutral sites.

Either that or just do away with this PHD degree needing level of trying to figure out where the heck you're going to playing the next game. 

"Home team is the Regional non-host but only if the team came from an even Sectional and played a team that started with the letter B and led after the first quarter but not if they hosted the Regional six years ago...blah blah..."

[Ballhawk]

1 hour ago, npcougar15 said:

The only other thing I'd think about touching is the privates. 

 

Donnie Baker said you could get in big trouble for this.....I swear to Gosh he did!

Seed sectional top 4 teams and play semistates at neutral sites with turf.  Let the rest fall as it may.

[Grover]

Do away with the 75 player limit in playoffs. 

[Basementbias]

1 hour ago, npcougar15 said:

I wouldn't change too much about the current season except:

1. Seed sectionals 1-4 (in 8 team sectionals) then random draw the other 4. better seed gets home field advantage. Once you hit regionals and or both teams are seeded it goes to the current format to determine home team.

 

The only other thing I'd think about touching is something with the privates. Don't know if that means they automatically play up a class? Create 2 classes with privates (small and big school) and have their own tournament? Don't know what the answer is exactly but it's time to get creative

 

Yes the 1-4 is the compromise I've always mention as being the first step in a seeded tournament. Would it be beneficial to seed by regionals as well? Make the regional game neutral site with schools tied to that regional. For example let's say Bishop Luers and Eastbrook meet in the regional game and it's played in Bluffton who was one of the sixteen participant schools in that regional  

[MarshallCounty]

16 minutes ago, Ballhawk said:

Donnie Baker said you could get in big trouble for this.....I swear to Gosh he did!

Seed sectional top 4 teams and play semistates at neutral sites with turf.  Let the rest fall as it may.

RIP Paul Ruebens 

[BTF]

18 minutes ago, Grover said:

Do away with the 75 player limit in playoffs. 

IHSAA: Directly from the coaches....................seed the tournament, make the regular season relevant. The team that went 8-1 deserves to play another week more so than the team that went  2-7. The kids might even learn something worthwhile from this lesson. Imagine this................"it's ok honey, D's and F's are just fine. Purdue and Indiana put all names in a hat and everyone get's an equal chance." We look kind of stupid on a national scale by drawing teams out of a hat. 

New start time of 7:30 pm. Daylight Savings Time has ruined Friday Night Lights. No thanks to wearing sunglasses at a high school game. I sit on whatever side is facing east. 

Four game sit-out period for players who transfer.

Edited August 9, 2023 by BTF

[tango]

7 minutes ago, BTF said:

IHSAA: Directly from the coaches....................seed the tournament, make the regular season relevant. The team that went 8-1 deserves to play another week more so than the team that went  2-7. The kids might even learn something worthwhile from this lesson. Imagine this................"it's ok honey, D's and F's are just fine. Purdue and Indiana put all names in a hat and everyone get's an equal chance." We look kind of stupid on a national scale by drawing teams out of a hat. 

New start time of 7:30 pm. Daylight Savings Time has ruined Friday Night Lights. No thanks to wearing sunglasses at a high school game. I sit on whatever side is facing east. 

Four game sit-out period for players who transfer.

I agree on start times. We are starting at 6:30 in the SIAC now, which is absolutely stupid. But I would go the other way on transfers. Get the IHSAA out of the decision-making process for transfer eligibility completely - let any kid transfer to whatever school he wants.  

[GoodKn19ht]

12 minutes ago, BTF said:

The team that went 8-1 deserves to play another week more so than the team that went  2-7

I wouldn't say they deserve to play another week, but certainly deserve to be at home. If a 2-7 wins then they deserved it too. Seeding the tourney won't take away from your "Cinderella" stories, I think that it would only enhance them! As you (all have) said it will make the regular season mean more!

[BTF]

Just now, GoodKn19ht said:

I wouldn't say they deserve to play another week, but certainly deserve to be at home. If a 2-7 wins then they deserved it too. Seeding the tourney won't take away from your "Cinderella" stories, I think that it would only enhance them! As you (all have) said it will make the regular season mean more!

Chances are, the coaches and players who go 8-1 are probably putting in more time, especially in the off-season, than the team that went 2-7. You normally get out of life what you put into it. I think it's offending to to pair the two best teams on one side and the two worst teams on the other. In my opinion, it's a form of enabling...........no one gets better from that. 

[GoodKn19ht]

Just now, BTF said:

Chances are, the coaches and players who go 8-1 are probably putting in more time, especially in the off-season, than the team that went 2-7. You normally get out of life what you put into it. I think it's offending to to pair the two best teams on one side and the two worst teams on the other. In my opinion, it's a form of enabling...........no one gets better from that. 

Oh I agree, I'm all in for seeding! I just think that there would still inevitably be upsets, no matter how the tournament is set up. So we should at least reward the teams that did perform during the regular season with home game(s).

[npcougar15]

32 minutes ago, Basementbias said:

Yes the 1-4 is the compromise I've always mention as being the first step in a seeded tournament. Would it be beneficial to seed by regionals as well? Make the regional game neutral site with schools tied to that regional. For example let's say Bishop Luers and Eastbrook meet in the regional game and it's played in Bluffton who was one of the sixteen participant schools in that regional  

About every sectional in Indiana you can go through and there is a clear top 4. Between Sagarin, AP poll, Coaches Poll, common sense, etc. the IHSAA should be able to figure it out. And guess what? If you are a 2 seed and should be a 1, you still don't see that other top team until the championship which is how it should be. It's such an easy fix, I have no idea why they don't do it. 

 

I'm pretty firmly against neutral site games (except for state of course). I know a little bit of it is bias because up here in the northern part of the state there really isn't too much travel between the schools. I know down in southern Indiana it gets to be quite a hall for some of the match ups. But at the end of the day I just don't think playing at a neutral site is going to create a great atmosphere for a championship game. I'd rather have 1 school pack a stadium with the entire community then have 2 schools travel 1.5 hours each with just their family friends. People talk about how the class system ruined Indiana High School basketball. I can see neutral or Saturday games doing something similar to football

[tango]

6 minutes ago, npcougar15 said:

But at the end of the day I just don't think playing at a neutral site is going to create a great atmosphere for a championship game. I'd rather have 1 school pack a stadium with the entire community then have 2 schools travel 1.5 hours each with just their family friends. People talk about how the class system ruined Indiana High School basketball. I can see neutral or Saturday games doing something similar to football

I agree 100%. 

[BTF]

28 minutes ago, GoodKn19ht said:

Oh I agree, I'm all in for seeding! I just think that there would still inevitably be upsets, no matter how the tournament is set up. So we should at least reward the teams that did perform during the regular season with home game(s).

That would be a good start. 

[Basementbias]

19 minutes ago, npcougar15 said:

About every sectional in Indiana you can go through and there is a clear top 4. Between Sagarin, AP poll, Coaches Poll, common sense, etc. the IHSAA should be able to figure it out. And guess what? If you are a 2 seed and should be a 1, you still don't see that other top team until the championship which is how it should be. It's such an easy fix, I have no idea why they don't do it. 

 

I'm pretty firmly against neutral site games (except for state of course). I know a little bit of it is bias because up here in the northern part of the state there really isn't too much travel between the schools. I know down in southern Indiana it gets to be quite a hall for some of the match ups. But at the end of the day I just don't think playing at a neutral site is going to create a great atmosphere for a championship game. I'd rather have 1 school pack a stadium with the entire community then have 2 schools travel 1.5 hours each with just their family friends. People talk about how the class system ruined Indiana High School basketball. I can see neutral or Saturday games doing something similar to football

I get that part of neutral site games. Though I think Semi State could work as a neutral site week that will bring the atmosphere. Sectionals definitely need to be at seeded teams home field & then higher ranked/seeds home field.

[BTF]

19 minutes ago, Basementbias said:

I get that part of neutral site games. Though I think Semi State could work as a neutral site week that will bring the atmosphere. Sectionals definitely need to be at seeded teams home field & then higher ranked/seeds home field.

Lucas Oil would be a good site. Too many important games being decided by inclimate weather. 

[BDGiant93]

29 minutes ago, BTF said:

Lucas Oil would be a good site. Too many important games being decided by inclimate weather. 

Football games in weather?

[Basementbias]

50 minutes ago, BTF said:

Lucas Oil would be a good site. Too many important games being decided by inclimate weather. 

I believe Iowa does that as they play the semi finals one week at UNI and the championships there the following week.

[AW0352]

If seeding is so hard then how come wrestling can do it for way more people every year at Sectionals and all major tournaments? It’s not hard.    Coaches get together and seed wrestlers the week before.  

[Offintheyard]

2 hours ago, BTF said:

Chances are, the coaches and players who go 8-1 are probably putting in more time, especially in the off-season, than the team that went 2-7. You normally get out of life what you put into it. I think it's offending to to pair the two best teams on one side and the two worst teams on the other. In my opinion, it's a form of enabling...........no one gets better from that. 

This has to be the most asinine thing I have read on this forum. You are seriously going to say that teams that go 2-7 didn't put as much if not more work than an 8-1 team? There are numerous reasons that several teams go 2-7 or worse and none of the reasons are that they didn't put in the time. Get out of here with that crap.