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As another football summer is drawing to an end - something that has been on my mind that I don't really know where to address it - but wanted to get it out there - I thought I'd share something that I've noticed that has been a troubling trend that I've observed throughout the last couple summers. These 11 on 11 "scrimmages" or whatever it is you want to call them. While they CAN be a great tool for self-evaluations - I've been a little "taken aback" or "put off" by some of the antics by fellow coaches that are supposedly there to coach up their own teams - but yet it turns into a "macho/chest bumping/screaming/hollering" antics after a given play or whatever it is. I get the competitive nature of these things - but in June/July there are no championships won or trophies given out...can't we just cool it with all of that? I know I sound like an old "get off my lawn" type - but it seems it has just gotten increasingly worse as the summers have gone on. I'm now into my 16th year coaching (where does the time go?) - but I find it hard to believe that "back in the day" (if these things were allowed) - some of my ol ball coaches going crazy after a play trying to drum up excitement. I've seen it escalate into chippyness - and kids take after their leaders - so what do you expect? As a coaching community - we can and should do better. That is all.

Why can't we let kids be kids? I can see participation numbers becoming a problem in the future. I can also see multi sport athletes feeling pinched and becoming individualized athletes. Both trends that aren't needed. When do kids have time to be with friends or make $ to save up for a car? I can see having some team workouts and lifting. However the 7 on 7s and 11 on 11s seem to be overkill. As has been mentioned, no one wins anything of importance and it doesn't equate to postseason awards all the time. This is something the IHSAA needs to limit or just eradicate in my opinion.

I feel like the biggest issues come from the 7 on 7 tournament or 11 on 11 camps where you go against teams you don't know. Was at a 7 on 7 tournament earlier this year where players started getting chippy, which is expected, but then coaches got involved and it only escalated from there. Luckily one of the coaches called it early or it could have resulted in something worse. I feel like a big amplifier of these issues are social media posts. We see it all the time at these prospect camps where players do something unrealistically stupid (my favorite is the totally like a real football game unpadded 1 on 1 pass rush where the Offensive Lineman grabs and sumo throws the Defensive Linemen) followed by what I think some have referenced as a "bro coach" coming up to that player to give them some flying chest bump. You can blame it on a lot of things, social media, bro coaches, poor influence from the NFL but it's something that just makes me eye roll every time I see it. In my opinion these summer scrimmages are best served when the opposing coaches have a relationship and can police their players, letting them know nobody is winning anything today. If that is not the overall theme then things like what have been described are going to happen almost every time.

How’s this look

I saw this at a recent 11 on 11 event. It was almost like both teams were actually trying to out celebrate each other after a "good" not even great play. This one one-upsmanship through cheering and running around, high fiving, screaming like monkeys etc. just takes away from time for quality reps. The Coaches and kids who are mentally weak enough to participate are just disappointing in my view. What about acting like you have had some success before or trying to maximize your time for quality reps. This is about discipline and we have very little in very few places as a society any more.

I will admit, that as coaches we do need to do better, I myself, need to do better as I was giving an official way more business than he truly needed. At the time, i let my own frustrations get the better of me, and after the scrimmage, had an incredible self realization that my focus was on the wrong thing. My focus during these scrimmages needs to be more inward towards our own team and making them better and not outward to things that are out of my control. I will make an effort to do better in the future. We need officials, and people that act like I did that day, are the reason officials stop officiating.

Come on now guys - it's really NOT THAT HARD. We do it in wrestling every year. You don't need sagarin or CalPreps or any other computer system. No anonymous voting. You get the head coaches in a room with a tournament director. You have a list of criteria (Head to head, common opponents, etc..) and you hash it out. It FINALLY gives some credence to a good regular season. Everyone wins in this scenario.

Looks like pike is listed twice

South Spencer omitted off of your small division list

This is what I could throw together in paint based on available resources. Anyone have a hi-res graphic of the new PAC logo... Perhaps someone was involved with printing it on a court or on a large sign? The only one I can find online is 300px wide. OK for online. Bad for print. Please check for errors... Tecumseh looks a little far west IMO.?.?.?

Correct - that's the competitive nature of the beast - I understand all that. HOWEVER- the original point of my post was to point out how often it seems to be "antagonized" or...I don't know the correct word to use - but sure isn't helped by celebrating/chest thumping coaches. Again, as a coaching community, we should be better.

Also, in regard to the home field in playoffs, it is Bobby Cox's balls that have been determining it vs what results would be different if higher seed hosts.

No love for the Hatchets, eh? Lol

Aaron Rodgers is everywhere!! https://nypost.com/2022/07/26/i-live-in-nude-with-my-boyfriend-clothes-make-me-anxious/

They lost 7 starters on offense on 7 on defense. On offense they return 3 OL and the QB (who is a nice player). On defense they return 1 DL, 2 ILBs and 1 DB (also the QB). Their JV lost to HH 37-6 and our JV beat them 53-0. On offense, I think they started a SO at RT 75 Powell and a SO at LG 59 Thomas. I don't think they started any on defense.

direct link: https://www.courierpress.com/story/sports/high-school/2022/07/26/ihsaa-football-mater-dei-motivated-return-state/65373787007/

Lol...I knew I had to be missing something, but I was wrapped up in work to figure it out the obvious. My bad.

Behind a paywall

There was actually an existing track around Inman Field for years that was eventually removed not long before the field was leveled and re-seeded in 2018. Still proud to call this home for the Alices.

Fair enough. I’ll respect an honest opinion. It may not work out for VL in the long term, but I’m not about to believe that for one second. Two down seasons does not determine what’s to come for a program. The best could very well be on the horizon for VL in the SIAC. And I believe you about not wanting to leave the PAC. It’s kind of the best of both worlds with the realignment. The BIG PAC is more or less a better version of the BIG 8, and you get some non-con scheduling freedom. I said from the moment the Big 8 split that the SIAC or PAC would be a great fit for VL and I stand by that. But seriously man…I’ve known some wise guys who need a shelf on wheels to rest that big head LOL.

I agree that you never win a state title or even a sectional in June and July. Some summer rules are good and some summer rules re not so good. I start my 35th season in 2022. Back in the day you would see high D 1 recruits at Bishop Dullaghan Camp and the North South game was a "Whose Who" of Indiana HS Football. As far as BD Camp goes you could go to Franklin and see Roncalli, Carmel, Seymour, Perry Meridian, and others battling each other. Go to Anderson and it would be Ben Davis, Lawrence Central, and Fort Wayne Homestead. The Belden Line Camp was a great builder of character and you "found out" how good you were and what you needed to work on. Ultimately it now falls on the coaches and players to hold their own summer scrimmages, 7 on 7s and practices. Everyone has to do it because everyone is doing it. (That makes a lot of sense) I think that is why we lose a lot of young coaches. Back in the day you could build decks, swimming pools, or run a lawn business. Work a summer job if you will. Those days are gone. You practice/work at football in the summer just as much as you do in the season. There are many positives as the game has gotten better. I just feel for the kids and staffs who pour their heart and soul into the game only to win a game or two year in and year out. Still Nothing like Friday Night!

... and for those who follow the last point and say "but basketball has neutral sites." After the sectional, each basketball host has four teams (so only 1/4 of the crowd would be a "home crowd") - and there is a decent chance the host school or a nearby school from its sectional will be among the four and thus bring a "home crowd." Also, basketball requires a much smaller commitment. Smaller venue means fewer workers (for example, don't have to have a chain crew, there's less need to have people control sideline access, likely fewer concession stands) and they're indoors, rather than working outdoors in November for a game featuring two different teams. The amount of work it takes to put on a football game vs. a basketball game (even a *big* basketball game like a regional or semistate) is astronomically greater.

If Reitz Bowl would ever upgrade its lights from their 1970’s, I would put it number one. I don’t mind a track, as long as it’s a legitimate setup, like Central Stadium. Enlow’s old configuration, where the track ran under the visitor stands or whatever Hatchet Hollow is supposed to be- I can do without. I am a fan of SS and VL. Decades ago when I would scout next week’s opponent, I would make note of how many visiting players were more interested in talking to fans than the game. One time at SS, a visiting backup had a full 5 minute conversation with a cheerleader while the game was going on. I really hope it worked out for that young man, because he was trying hard to impress her. Lol

When I coached basketball, we tried to dial things back in the offseason because we a) encouraged our girls to play multiple sports, and b) tried to be respectful of their time. We'd do 1-2 open gyms a week in the spring, go hard in June with league play and a couple weekend tournaments, then hit the gym again in the fall 2-3 times a week in the run-up to the season. At the same time, we didn't push our kids into AAU programs. The better kids played AAU, the others didn't. AAU/club was a breeder of bad habits anyway. What happened? Our numbers dwindled, big-time, because those kids got into soccer (where they're expected to be on a travel team to play high school, and play travel year-round) or volleyball (where they're expected to be on a travel team to play high school, and play travel year-round, and where our varsity VB coach at the time used to threaten to cut kids if they played basketball instead of/in addition to club volleyball in the winter) or softball (which is a big deal at our school, and oh yeah, expects kids to play year-round travel). So, in trying to be respectful of our kids' time, we instead lost kids to other sports because basketball was seen as "less important" because we weren't pushing our kids onto year-round travel teams. The program has rebounded, in part because of kids who are dedicated basketball players and because we had age-group (school-based) teams playing in area leagues down to third grade, so because kids are playing "travel" or on "select teams" at younger ages, they're more dedicated and stick with the sport rather than getting plucked away by others. It's absurd.

Last I knew he changed his allegiance to Lewis Cass. Ain't no McDonald's in Walton. They do, however, have The Dog Shed.

Private coaches, 7on7 leagues, travel baseball/aau basketball is hurting high school football coaches. Our high school football coaches put in so much time and work with the kids, assistants, at the school, going to clinics, etc. It is important as parents of young kids to trust in these men/women. Just because you take your kid to a private coach and pay him money does not mean he is going to be “D1”. Our high school coaches know football. Earlier this summer the indystar put out a n article regarding a QB training coach up in Westfield. To me, that was harmful for our head and assistant coaches. Parents get caught in a trap thinking these special coaches know more. Sure, that individual might know some interesting techniques, but it is important to be at all your high school football first. Also, these high school teachers/coaches need to be paid more. It makes it very difficult on them with the amount of time they are putting in. Football is a special game for special people. It is not AAU or travel baseball where you get to play a 100s of games throughout the year. It takes a tremendous amount of time, lifting, skill work, agility, training to get to those 10 or so games in the fall. Trust our coaches!!!

https://www.courierpress.com/story/sports/high-school/2022/07/25/ihsaa-football-defending-3a-champion-gibson-southern-has-new-look/65375464007/

The other coaches. See also: Wrestling

Farmer Fran and his Panthers laying in the weeds!

I will just say those stupid GS Dads are real pieces of work!

BTW @DT im sure you noticed before you posted…but on the Facebook page where you shared the PAC map…..it has markers for Wood Memorial and Cannelton haha. im sure you know it’s outdated and It was probably the only one you could find too. But just in case

What upsets me the most is not understanding that 'kids' are KIDS. We have all done idiotic things at 15-17....IMO, unless those things are felonious or injurious to others.....perhaps we should look upon it as 'stupid behavior". Is vaping weed really an issue that should be looked upon as a injurious situation? Honestly, most of us just loaded a bong or twisted up a "fatty" back in the day. Is it ok? Perhaps not. But should it be a career defining moment? IMO, no! It is a learning situation, and a teaching moment. Then again, I am a LIBERAL at heart.....And dammed proud of it!

WL renounced their Catholic faith and were exorcised out of the Sectional of Death. Got a pretty favorable placement in S25. Will still have to likely meet Mishawaka Marian in regionals or Chatard in semi-state, but I have to imagine they will welcome the odds in S25 than the previous seasons where they had to always have that early exit at the hands of their "Catholic brethren" looming in their minds when the ping pong balls started bouncing.

They will be a force playing schools similar their size. Not a lock by a long shot. I think this forum has thrown Snider and Dwenger into the "chump" category. If opposing coaches are that dumb, it's game over.

Yes, assistant role....they are glad to have him back. Guy at work from Ferdinand (Forest Park) told me today, with a wink, that Bob Clayton was applying for the Forest Park job. LOL....I told him if that happened FP would probably decide they couldn't play football anymore. Not sure kids today would handle getting kicked in the rear (physically HARD!) when they didn't get off the ball fast enough or having a clipboard broken over their head. But hey, don't knock it, such things make great football teams. BTW....saw Coach Clayton last Friday night at the Chateau....looks pretty good for an old guy. Wasn't terrifying at all....

Sure you can have your opinion. I won’t comment on the liberal part. It wouldn’t be a great day for you lol. Kids will be kids, and that’s part of growing up. If your a athlete you held to a higher standard, because again it’s about a Team! Not “I”. Don’t play sports is my direction. You want to ruin what you work for during the summer, and during the season. Great Take a different direction. You have the greatest four years of your life in front of you. It goes fast as we all know. Not saying kids should be suspended a whole season. But maybe a ego check is required. You get caught that’s on you, and your selfishness.