Transfers Happening?

[slicer28]

7 hours ago, CoachMack219 said:

Lets focus on the bolded/ underlined section here. Having had the opportunity to participate does NOT mean you HAD the opportunity to participate in varsity athletics just because you existed as 14-17 year old. If you're in high school 3 years and only make a varsity roster for 2 years (for this exercise we'll assume this is a 3-sport athlete that has been on Varsity 2 full years in all 3 sports), that means you only HAD THE OPPORUNITY TO PARTICIPATE  in 2 out of 3 of those possible years at the VARSITY level, which is what matters for transfers. So if this hypothetical kid played varsity as a sophomore and junior, but did not as a freshman, they're considered Having had the opportunity to participate even though they did not, in fact, get a varsity opportunity to participate as a freshman? Their opportunity in year 1 was "well you're in our (member) school and have a pulse so you had a chance!" Idk, it's weird to me but to be honest this whole situation is weird so lets just buckle up.. Lol 

 

Disclosure: This is not an attack on slicer28's wording or explanation, or anyone's for that matter. Just facilitating some more conversation on this controversial topic. 

I get your point, but eligibility is based on opportunity to participate at the HS level.  No distinction between Freshmen/JV/Varsity.  It just seems like the way the rule is written as an athlete you need to make up your mind before you start your Junior season if you want to "take your talents elsewhere". 

As a separate point, how is it possible that players and coaches can avoid "undue influence" when you KNOW that players and parents are going to contact schools and coaches directly if they are interested in transferring.  Does anyone really believe that players are going to make transfer decisions for athletic reasons blindly? 

Disclosure: No offense taken @CoachMack219.  It's a messy rule.

[Daniel_Bragg]

15 hours ago, slicer28 said:

I get your point, but eligibility is based on opportunity to participate at the HS level.  No distinction between Freshmen/JV/Varsity.  It just seems like the way the rule is written as an athlete you need to make up your mind before you start your Junior season if you want to "take your talents elsewhere". 

As a separate point, how is it possible that players and coaches can avoid "undue influence" when you KNOW that players and parents are going to contact schools and coaches directly if they are interested in transferring.  Does anyone really believe that players are going to make transfer decisions for athletic reasons blindly? 

Disclosure: No offense taken @CoachMack219.  It's a messy rule.

Undue influence doesn't mean that the athlete was encouraged or incentivized to move.  It means that they are making the choice outside of their own free will or without adequate attention to the consequences.  I don't think parents or coaches are going to start dragging players to their program, without the consent of the kids.

[CoachMack219]

15 hours ago, slicer28 said:

I get your point, but eligibility is based on opportunity to participate at the HS level.  No distinction between Freshmen/JV/Varsity.  It just seems like the way the rule is written as an athlete you need to make up your mind before you start your Junior season if you want to "take your talents elsewhere". 

As a separate point, how is it possible that players and coaches can avoid "undue influence" when you KNOW that players and parents are going to contact schools and coaches directly if they are interested in transferring.  Does anyone really believe that players are going to make transfer decisions for athletic reasons blindly? 

Disclosure: No offense taken @CoachMack219.  It's a messy rule.

For sure a messy rule. The undue influence question is a GREAT one because NOBODY is going to transfer their kid (for athletic reasons) without first determining where is the right fit for their athlete. Which, as a result, puts the coaches, AD's, etc. at risk of becoming a party to or active participant in undue influence. The IHSAA by-laws define undue influence as... "the act of encouraging or inducing a prospective student to attend a school for athletic purposes." 

So for the sake of this conversation, the scenario @slicer28 lays out could very well fit the definition of undue influence. Parent calls and asks a coach or AD about moving their kid to their school, asks questions about the athletic department/ specific sport program they want their kid to join. Coach or AD answers ANY of those questions and boom, they just recruited, OR as the IHSAA puts it they just performed "the act of encouraging or inducing a prospective student to attend a school for athletic purposes." Even though they didn't ACTUALLY do anything wrong by answering mom/ dad's questions they can be said to have encouraged a prospective student to attend their school for athletic purposes based on how they answer those questions. As you and I said slicer, MESSY! 

[Daniel_Bragg]

8 minutes ago, CoachMack219 said:

The IHSAA by-laws define undue influence as... "the act of encouraging or inducing a prospective student to attend a school for athletic purposes."

Thank you for that clarification.

[CoachMack219]

4 minutes ago, Daniel_Bragg said:

Thank you for that clarification.

I was in the process of replying to slicer and while working through my response, you replied which took me to the by-laws to define undue influence, so thank you. Lol 

[First_Backer_Inside]

2 hours ago, CoachMack219 said:

Which, as a result, puts the coaches, AD's, etc. at risk of becoming a party to or active participant in undue influence. The IHSAA by-laws define undue influence as... "the act of encouraging or inducing a prospective student to attend a school for athletic purposes." 

 

Can students/athletes get in trouble for encouraging athletes to come to their school? They might have the biggest influence of all in all of this.

[CoachMack219]

2 minutes ago, First_Backer_Inside said:

Can students/athletes get in trouble for encouraging athletes to come to their school? They might have the biggest influence of all in all of this.

I would have to dig deeper into the rule (undue influence is a LONG rule and the definition happened to be at the end of paragraph one, which was nice for my little coaching brain lol) to fully answer this question. I would assume "no" only because I have never seen nor heard of it happening before but you are correct. The kids do the bulk of the recruiting/ undue influencing, in most cases. 

[WCGrad92]

The kids do this sort of thing all the time,  the parents dont always listen or abide by what kids are asking though. It happens for sure, where kids talk to each other... and they end up wanting to play... if the parents end up sending their kids to the new school, as long as a coach is not the person in the ear of said player, then all is fine.

[Irishman]

3 hours ago, First_Backer_Inside said:

Can students/athletes get in trouble for encouraging athletes to come to their school? They might have the biggest influence of all in all of this.

No consequences for kids doing it. At the end of the day it's hard to prove. One thing to keep in mind is that the IHSAA expects self reporting when school representatives become aware of an issue. The IHSAA simply does not have the resources to investigate much at all. What tends to happen from what I have seen is that kids and/or parents will slip up while trying to transfer. I know a few kids and the parents from years ago that were asked why they want to transfer, and they say "to play football".....or whatever sport. The message from the IHSAA is clear to schools, once that happens, the process ends. yes, I am aware there are loopholes to get around that...and that does happen too. 

But with something like 3,000-4,000 athletic transfers filed with the IHSAA, like I said they just do not have the time or resources to really investigate unless something is glaringly obvious. 

[crimsonace1]

23 hours ago, CoachMack219 said:

I would have to dig deeper into the rule (undue influence is a LONG rule and the definition happened to be at the end of paragraph one, which was nice for my little coaching brain lol) to fully answer this question. I would assume "no" only because I have never seen nor heard of it happening before but you are correct. The kids do the bulk of the recruiting/ undue influencing, in most cases. 

One way schools often get around the "undue influence" rule is having the *parents* of current players contact the families of prospective student athletes they want to bring in. The coaching staff didn't do the recruiting, it was just casual conversation among "parents." 

Same thing with players - if Bishop Sycamore's star tight end Jimmy Snatches talks to his buddy, who's currently a backup quarterback at Central City High and says "hey, we need a QB next year. Why don't you check us out?," that's not undue influence. But if Bishop Sycamore's *coach*  does so, that's a different story. 

Getting your coaches embedded with travel programs or "skills academies" seems to be another way of recruiting without actually recruiting. 

 

[Sparty]

1 hour ago, crimsonace1 said:

One way schools often get around the "undue influence" rule is having the *parents* of current players contact the families of prospective student athletes they want to bring in. The coaching staff didn't do the recruiting, it was just casual conversation among "parents." 

Same thing with players - if Bishop Sycamore's star tight end Jimmy Snatches talks to his buddy, who's currently a backup quarterback at Central City High and says "hey, we need a QB next year. Why don't you check us out?," that's not undue influence. But if Bishop Sycamore's *coach*  does so, that's a different story. 

Getting your coaches embedded with travel programs or "skills academies" seems to be another way of recruiting without actually recruiting. 

 

And at BS HS you don’t even have to go to “real” school.  

[CWPRD67]

On 5/12/2025 at 12:03 PM, Indiana Fan said:

What?!?! Is this real? If so, that is ridiculous. Should not be called a visit. If that’s the case, that’s 100% illegal based off of what the IHSAA commissioner has sent out about recruiting.

I'm sure there are screenshots out there, but it has probably been deleted or it was on an IG live and went away... there has been a lot of murkiness surrounding this rule and some seeing it as a free-for-all without actually self-regulating

[hhpatriot04]

Any updates?

[psaboy]

Where is the ISHAA transfer portal?

[Indiana Fan]

On 5/19/2025 at 9:37 AM, CWPRD67 said:

I'm sure there are screenshots out there, but it has probably been deleted or it was on an IG live and went away... there has been a lot of murkiness surrounding this rule and some seeing it as a free-for-all without actually self-regulating

Unreal. Can’t believe that was allowed.

[TheMadness1]

On 5/16/2025 at 12:08 PM, crimsonace1 said:

One way schools often get around the "undue influence" rule is having the *parents* of current players contact the families of prospective student athletes they want to bring in. The coaching staff didn't do the recruiting, it was just casual conversation among "parents." 

Same thing with players - if Bishop Sycamore's star tight end Jimmy Snatches talks to his buddy, who's currently a backup quarterback at Central City High and says "hey, we need a QB next year. Why don't you check us out?," that's not undue influence. But if Bishop Sycamore's *coach*  does so, that's a different story. 

Getting your coaches embedded with travel programs or "skills academies" seems to be another way of recruiting without actually recruiting. 

 

That’s basically been the traditional route of transfers for years now. I think the IHSAA just got sick of trying to prosecute all that grey area, so hopes the new rule save them the trouble. 

[tango]

On 6/7/2025 at 6:02 AM, TheMadness1 said:

That’s basically been the traditional route of transfers for years now. I think the IHSAA just got sick of trying to prosecute all that grey area, so hopes the new rule save them the trouble. 

I think the IHSAA got sick of losing judicial reviews and seeing the articles in the IndyStar...

[Robert]

On 3/17/2025 at 2:32 PM, Sparty said:

Sometimes it takes time. And that is ok.  I want kids that are bought in completely.  That goes into who plays for me.  

Until the scoreboard dictates...

[BDGiant93]

On 6/9/2025 at 12:37 PM, tango said:

I think the IHSAA got sick of losing judicial reviews and seeing the articles in the IndyStar...

The IHSAA was forced into this by the Indiana General Assembly's House Bill 1064 (2025).

[temptation]

We aren’t too far away from Twitter declarations…

The classic “blessed to receive an offer from” nonsense.

In fact, if you dig, it’s already happening.

Edited June 13, 2025 by temptation

[Indiana Fan]

17 hours ago, temptation said:

We aren’t too far away from Twitter declarations…

The classic “blessed to receive an offer from” nonsense.

In fact, if you dig, it’s already happening.

Exactly. It already is happening. HSE just lost a defensive back to Warren and the young man posted he is blessed to be transferring 

[Sparty]

7 hours ago, Indiana Fan said:

Exactly. It already is happening. HSE just lost a defensive back to Warren and the young man posted he is blessed to be transferring 

Corny clowns

[psaboy]

Wish we never had "social media" 

[Robert]

On 6/14/2025 at 8:07 PM, psaboy said:

Wish we never had "social media" 

Slide rules, calculators, get off of my lawn

[Titan32]

I was blessed to receive my 37th offer. If a kid is offer counting on Twitter, they are getting some really bad advice somewhere.